EightBitBlood comments on When we eat the billionaires, we should spare Gabe Newell? No?

[–] EightBitBlood@lemmy.world 0 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (10 children)

I see granting access for anyone to make games for Steam as a good cause.

The opportunity cost for what profit could be made by closing that is multitudes of yachts worth.

Just because you do not value this as a good cause does not mean it is not.

Does Gabe have more yachts than are needed? Yes. But again, you can't just say he's greedy because he has them. That's being incredibly biased.

Instead, how about you tell me what actions of his has made him greedy that don't involve his assets?

I can name hundreds of ways Musk should be drawn and quartered based on his actions that have nothing to do with his wealth, but rather his actual documented choices.

What choices / actions / or anything of actual greed has Gabe done that you can point to?

It's like saying anything with a swastika on it is for Nazis without realizing Hindus have been using a right oriented Swastika to represent good fortune for hundreds of years.

Gabe Newall has done the following with his 11 Billion fortune:

Co-founded "The Heart of Racing" car racing team that raises money for Children's charity.
Donates heavily to the Seattle Children's Hospital and several others around the world.
Founded Foundry10, a non profit education company that helps neuro divergent kids learn through new methods of education
Started InkFish to expand the scientific study of our oceans and is now the second highest individual donor towards marine research on the planet.

https://80.lv/articles/gabe-newell-reportedly-plans-to-invest-usd300-million-to-marine-research

That's why he has those yachts.

Same reason Hindus have their swastikas.

Their actions speak louder than the symbols they use suggest. Even when those symbols are Yachts.

He has 11 Billion. Everyone else even close to his level of market control has several magnitudes more. Why does he have so little when he owns a virtual monopoly on digital distribution?

Because he's not in it for maximizing his bank account.

permalink

fedilink

source

parent

hideshow 10 child comments

[–] AnyOldName3@lemmy.world 3 points 10 months ago (9 children)

The billion dollars in superyatchts is just the personally-owned luxury kind that billionaries like to hoard, not marine research boats that he has funded. Him giving away some of his money doesn't mean that he's not also frivilously spent more money than most people could hope to see in a lifetime.

Fundamentally, I don't think we're going to agree here, as I fundamentally believe that there's an amount of money beyond which there are no ethical grounds for keeping it, and it's much lower than $11 billion. Newell has kept money above that threshold instead of giving everything he made beyond that threshold away (even illiquid stuff like part of his stake in Valve could, in principle, be given to a charity so the profit from Steam went straight into the charity), and I and plenty of other people would see that as greedy. Others might say that the fact that he's given anything away that he wasn't legally required to means that he's not greedy. These are subjective ethical opinions, so even though they can't be reconciled, it's not a big deal. Different people think different things are wrong.

The reason I've been replying at all is that some of the things you've stated to be facts are untrue, not that I'm trying to convince you that all billionaires are unethical.

permalink

fedilink

source

parent

hideshow 9 child comments

[–] EightBitBlood@lemmy.world 0 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (8 children)

What have I said that isn't true?

https://robbreport.com/motors/marine/billionaire-gabe-newell-oceanco-gigayacht-leviathan-1237360429/

The 364-foot Leviathan was designed for billionaire gaming visionary Gabe Newell, who acquired the Dutch shipyard this past April.

Leviathan is the latest addition to Newell’s Inkfish fleet and will be used to further scientific research in the marine sector. Occupying the place of the standard beach club is a fully equipped dive center, laboratory, and a hospital. There’s even a 3-D printing workshop where the crew can create spare or replacement parts. “Yachts have great potential to serve as platforms for scientific research,” adds Newell. “It’s about recognizing that you’re part of a broader community and ensuring the yacht’s presence adds value to the communities around it.”

You are just continuing to make assumptions based entirely on the assets he owns instead of his behaviour.

Something I keep pointing out, and is why I have also been responding.

I am completely on your side and feel that anyone with over a billion is an ethical and moral burden. However, I'm also wise enough to recognize that as a goal to strive towards not a destination to judge against. So I'm not going to chastise those actively working towards that goal, even if they are a billionaire.

permalink

fedilink

source

parent

hideshow 8 child comments

[–] AnyOldName3@lemmy.world 3 points 10 months ago (1 child)

As I said, he also owns a billion dollars worth of superyatchts for personal use in addition to the one(s) nominally for marine research.

permalink

fedilink

source

parent

hideshow 1 child comment

[–] EightBitBlood@lemmy.world -2 points 10 months ago

Your assumption all his yachts were for pleasure has already been proven wrong. Now you're just moving the goal posts.

As I said, he's the second largest doner to marine research on the entire planet, and the burden of proof for proving his yachts are ALL for personal use is something you've never provided, only assumed.

I've proved 1/3 were for scientific research. I'm not going to do the other 2/3 just for you to ignore and move the goal posts elsewhere.

Prove your point, and I'll believe it.

Until then, he's still a billionaire instead of the trillionaire he could be, so I'm not going to think poorly of him just because he's not fitting some arbitrary number of currency tied to his worth that magically makes you think he's moral.

Instead I will judge him based on his actions. The ones that I have detailed have unquestionably made the world a better place for many more people than him.

How about you actually tell me something he's done wrong that's worth your judgement, instead of basing it entirely on yachts you won't research?

permalink

fedilink

source

parent

[–] CileTheSane@lemmy.ca 2 points 10 months ago (5 children)

You know what would further more research than give offering a portion of your super yacht to scientific research? Not building a billion dollar super yacht and giving that money to scientific research instead. Let the people who know what they're doing decide what they need and not be beholden to your whims.

permalink

fedilink

source

parent

hideshow 5 child comments

[–] EightBitBlood@lemmy.world -1 points 10 months ago (4 children)

Like the 3000 scientists, engineers, and designers that helped him build that yacht for research?

That collaboration started with the design and build. Newell joined forces with YTMC, Y.CO, the Oceanco Design team, Lateral Naval Architects, Mark Berryman Design, and thousands of designers, engineers, and other experts to bring his dream vessel to fruition. The names of the nearly 3,000 contributors are listed near the main staircase, in fact. “It is this level of collaboration that sets Leviathan apart from anything we’ve built before,” Oceanco CEO Marcel Onkenhout said in a statement.

Is there more efficient ways to spend this money on research? Sure. But don't equate this effort as meaningless just because it's not perfect. It's a great place to be a researcher, but it's still for research.

permalink

fedilink

source

parent

hideshow 4 child comments

[–] CileTheSane@lemmy.ca 1 point 10 months ago (3 children)

to bring his dream vessel to fruition.

God how much money was wasted on havingthousands of people work on the design of his vanity project?

Yes, it's better than other vanity projects, but it is still a wasteful vanity project.

permalink

fedilink

source

parent

hideshow 3 child comments

[–] EightBitBlood@lemmy.world 0 points 10 months ago* (2 children)

It's his vessel because he paid for it. That's how money works. There's no other pronoun that is appropriate.

Here's the rest of the article that completely unwinds how far you want to stretch that term:

"His" yacht made through collaboration:

“Not only have we designed a very unusual yacht that leans into Oceanco’s strengths of innovation and design, but the team has also been willing to collaborate with us on evolving the process.”

"His" yacht made to have the least environmental impact from noise or oil polution (Diesel hybrid electric engine):

Huge efforts were made to reduce noise and vibration, thereby creating a pleasant onboard environment. The hybrid diesel-electric propulsion system is whisper-quiet, and the engine room is positioned further forward to reduce noise. The built-in battery bank also allows for silent nighttime operation.

"His" yacht made to have little maintenance requirements so the crew can focus on science and research:

Leviathan is also incredibly low-maintenance. The off-white exterior and synthetic handrails require less cleaning, for example. That means the crew can spend less time on routine maintenance and more time on more important tasks. “We adopted a crew-centric approach that really digs into how Leviathan is operated and maintained,” explains Newell.

"His" thoughts on "His" yacht being used to better the scientific community instead of just him.

“Yachts have great potential to serve as platforms for scientific research,” adds Newell. “It’s about recognizing that you’re part of a broader community and ensuring the yacht’s presence adds value to the communities around it.”

How about you ask yourself how many scientists and engineers HE paid to have a job to work on this?

How about you ask how much he pays their research salaries still and provided them a better vessel to do their job on than anyone else?

Why do you insist that you know how to better spend his money when it's already going to people that need it for a cause that's needed?

Just because you want to claim his money could be used better doesn't mean it currently isn't being used well.

You just see a yacht and think the worse. Worlds far less black and white.

permalink

fedilink

source

parent

hideshow 2 child comments

[–] CileTheSane@lemmy.ca 1 point 10 months ago (1 child)

Huge efforts were made to reduce noise and vibration, thereby creating a pleasant onboard environment.

Oh what a good billionaire, his efforts to make his onboard environment more pleasant is also beneficial to the outside environment! Such a giver!

The off-white exterior and synthetic handrails require less cleaning, for example.

The colour of paint chosen for his mega yacht really shows how much he cares!

How about you ask yourself how many scientists and engineers HE paid to have a job to work on this?

And you haven't been listening. I'm not repeating myself on this point anymore.

You just see a yacht and think the worse. Worlds far less black and white.

Literally the opposite of what I said at the end of my previous post. If you're not going to bother to read what I say then what are we doing here?

permalink

fedilink

source

parent

hideshow 1 child comment

[–] EightBitBlood@lemmy.world 1 point 10 months ago

The end of your previous post:

Yes, it's better than other vanity projects, but it is still a wasteful vanity project.

The literal definition of a vanity project:

https://dictionary.reverso.net/english-definition/vanity+project

project undertaken for self-satisfaction.

Each one of the examples I provided shows very clearly this yacht was NOT made for HIS self-satisfaction. Rather, it was literally made to the satisfaction of the research team that uses the yacht.

Specifically:

"His" yacht being used to better the scientific community instead of just him.

Made quite literally for a large team of scientists as he is the second largest contributor to deep sea research on the planet. Nearly the exact opposite of being for vanity.

"His" yacht made to have the least environmental impact from noise or oil pollution.

Made for the environment. Not Gabe. So not for vanity.

Huge efforts were made to reduce noise and vibration, thereby creating a pleasant onboard environment.

Made for sensative aquatic life that engine noises can disturb and affect the research of. Not for Gabe. So not for vanity.

"His" yacht made to have little maintenance requirements so the crew can focus on science and research.

Made to be easy to work on for the hundreds of crew that maintain it. Not for Gabe. So not for vanity.

Every point of my last comment was proving your statement about this being a vanity project completely and unquestionably wrong. But I guess I just understand your last sentence better than you.

You are shitting on the best deep sea scientific research vessel in existence while implying you have the moral high ground. There's nothing immoral about scientific research just because it happens on a yacht.

You are literally using the same logic as a cop saying a person with dark skin is a criminal. This yacht clearly isn't a vanity project. It is for Inksea, and being used to help fight climate change and the affect that has on deep sea ocean currents.

But to you this yacht is just as criminal as a dark skinned person is to a cop. No exceptions.

Please understand: the point you are making is not incorrect. But the way you are making it very much is.

I completely agree that Billionaires shouldn't exist, and in general most yachts are unquestionably vanity projects. But this one clearly isn't.

So if you want to make your point heard, going about it through uncompromising bigotry is just about the worst way to make it.

permalink

fedilink

source

parent