this post was submitted on 23 Jun 2023
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On the anniversary of the Dobbs decision, 53% say abortion access nationwide has become too difficult, a new NBC News poll finds.

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[โ€“] [email protected] 4 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

I'm kinda splitting hairs here, but you seem to be using the terms "morality" and "ethics" interchangeably when they don't mean the same thing.

Ethics are social norms. Morality is personal. You cannot legislate morality because everyone makes those individual decisions anyway, and we will all rebel against rules we consider immoral. Ethical practices are those that balance everyone's divergent senses of morality in ways that allow us to actually function as a society. All legislation is ultimately legislating ethics.

Murder is unethical because we ban it. We ban murder because we believe it's immoral. But at least where I live, we can have a little ethical murder sometimes, as a treat -- if you call it capital punishment first. Many people, including myself, consider this immoral and would support changing the laws which inform (but do not define!) our system of ethics.

Also, I don't think you understand that abortion clinics are run by groups of physicians who are playing the role of this "medical board." It also seems you don't understand that limiting the incidence of DIY/back alley abortions is [the] major reason for making abortions accessible/legal. Telling someone they can't get an abortion in a clinic won't stop them from getting an abortion. It'll just stop them from getting an abortion in a clinic.

[โ€“] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago

I think my use of ethics and morality are all correct. I don't see any incongruence. To also split hairs, we legislate morality by voting. That act is how we affect moral legislative change at the state or national level. Further, you seem to be conflating ethics with laws. Laws can be unethical, such as the death penalty you mention. There are different ethical schools and they are often in stark disagreement with each other.

I am quite aware of how abortion clinics operate in the US. There are rarely boards. In states which permit elective late term abortions, there is generally one or sometimes two physicians who assess the medical fitness of the patient. They are not assessing the need. I think you are confused about the premise of the discussion. The number of physicians is immaterial to the standard by which they are assessing the patient.

I am also aware that one of the arguments from activists for legal elective late term abortions is that women will use coat hangers. I have not seen any convincing evidence of this and I think the risk is low. By keeping first trimester elective abortion legal, I believe almost all risk is eliminated. It is further reduced by criminalising the murder of fetuses. Studies reveal that harsh penalties work very well to reduce crime (I'm happy to cite studies if you like).