▲ 778 ▼ Half as Hot (mander.xyz) submitted 2 years ago by fossilesque@mander.xyz to c/science_memes@mander.xyz 101 comments fedilink hide all child comments
[–] P4ulin_Kbana@lemmy.eco.br 8 points 2 years ago (1 child) Could someone please explain? permalink fedilink source hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] bdonvr 22 points 2 years ago (1 child) Let's say the summer average is 30⁰C or 303.15 Kelvin The absolute coldest possible temperature is -273.15⁰C, or 0K. Halfway between absolute zero and 30⁰C/303.15K is somewhere around -121⁰C/152K So if it were half as hot in the summer, it would be colder than ever recorded on earth. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] frezik@midwest.social 12 points 2 years ago (2 children) In short, you don't want to use a temperature scale with an arbitrary starting point for doing calculations like this. The freezing point of water is no more or less arbitrary than the freezing point of oxygen or sodium or anything else. It's just one that's somewhat useful for everyday use. When handling calculations for multiplying temperature, you want an absolute scale like Kelvin. Or Rankine if you're that kind of pervert. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] GrammarPolice@lemmy.world 2 points 2 years ago (1 child) What makes Kelvin absolute, and why is Celsius "wobbly"? I failed physics in high school permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Bumblefumble@lemm.ee 8 points 2 years ago* (1 child) 0 K is like when there is 0 heat basically, while celsius isn't. Imagine a unit for distance called "goob" where 0 goobs is 100 m and 1 goob is 115 m. In that case the goob unit would behave differently than a meter when you multiply and divide because 0 of the units don't actually correspond to "nothing" in a physical sense. That's exactly how the Celsius scale is, with zero being placed somewhere arbitrarily, not at a physical zero. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] lightsblinken@lemmy.world 4 points 2 years ago (1 child) i feel like i need more goob in my life. do you sell rulers? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Bumblefumble@lemm.ee 2 points 2 years ago Bit of an awkward scale for a ruler, but I can sell you one from -6.6666666.... to -6.65 goobs. permalink fedilink source parent [–] yetiftw@lemmy.world -4 points 2 years ago (1 child) absolute scales are still arbitrary. you would probably want to use a scale that measures "perceived heat" which is different than average kinetic energy permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] KairuByte@lemmy.dbzer0.com 3 points 2 years ago (2 children) Kelvin is just our word for it, but that is the point of “no heat”. It isn’t arbitrary, there is no “negative kelvin” just like you cannot make something colder than absolute zero. So if you take the difference between “coldest possible temp” and “average summer temp”, then slice it in half, you’re getting temperatures that would kill most life on earth. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] frezik@midwest.social 2 points 2 years ago Just to nitpick, there are negative kelvins. I don't really understand it, myself, but I know it exists due to the specifics of how temperature is defined. Negative kelvins are actually extremely hot. permalink fedilink source parent [–] yetiftw@lemmy.world 0 points 2 years ago (2 children) just because it has a reason doesn't make it not arbitrary. you can ultimately come up with a reason for all arbitrary decisions permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] frezik@midwest.social 1 point 2 years ago (1 child) Is there a way to distinguish between arbitrary and non-arbitrary? Or is literally everything ever arbitrary? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] yetiftw@lemmy.world 1 point 2 years ago (1 child) literally every definition ever is arbitrary permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] frezik@midwest.social 1 point 2 years ago (1 child) Then what's the point of even calling it arbitrary? If it covers everything, then there's no reason for the word. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] yetiftw@lemmy.world 1 point 2 years ago that's not true. there are things that are not definitions. like my bed for instance, there are aspects that are arbitrary (my personal preferences, design choices, etc) and aspects that are not arbitrary (its physical form that exists beyond definition) permalink fedilink source parent [–] KairuByte@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 point 2 years ago (1 child) Do you not understand what the word arbitrary means?… permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] yetiftw@lemmy.world 1 point 2 years ago maybe you're the one who doesn't understand the ramifications of its meaning permalink fedilink source parent
[–] bdonvr 22 points 2 years ago (1 child) Let's say the summer average is 30⁰C or 303.15 Kelvin The absolute coldest possible temperature is -273.15⁰C, or 0K. Halfway between absolute zero and 30⁰C/303.15K is somewhere around -121⁰C/152K So if it were half as hot in the summer, it would be colder than ever recorded on earth. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] frezik@midwest.social 12 points 2 years ago (2 children) In short, you don't want to use a temperature scale with an arbitrary starting point for doing calculations like this. The freezing point of water is no more or less arbitrary than the freezing point of oxygen or sodium or anything else. It's just one that's somewhat useful for everyday use. When handling calculations for multiplying temperature, you want an absolute scale like Kelvin. Or Rankine if you're that kind of pervert. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] GrammarPolice@lemmy.world 2 points 2 years ago (1 child) What makes Kelvin absolute, and why is Celsius "wobbly"? I failed physics in high school permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Bumblefumble@lemm.ee 8 points 2 years ago* (1 child) 0 K is like when there is 0 heat basically, while celsius isn't. Imagine a unit for distance called "goob" where 0 goobs is 100 m and 1 goob is 115 m. In that case the goob unit would behave differently than a meter when you multiply and divide because 0 of the units don't actually correspond to "nothing" in a physical sense. That's exactly how the Celsius scale is, with zero being placed somewhere arbitrarily, not at a physical zero. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] lightsblinken@lemmy.world 4 points 2 years ago (1 child) i feel like i need more goob in my life. do you sell rulers? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Bumblefumble@lemm.ee 2 points 2 years ago Bit of an awkward scale for a ruler, but I can sell you one from -6.6666666.... to -6.65 goobs. permalink fedilink source parent [–] yetiftw@lemmy.world -4 points 2 years ago (1 child) absolute scales are still arbitrary. you would probably want to use a scale that measures "perceived heat" which is different than average kinetic energy permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] KairuByte@lemmy.dbzer0.com 3 points 2 years ago (2 children) Kelvin is just our word for it, but that is the point of “no heat”. It isn’t arbitrary, there is no “negative kelvin” just like you cannot make something colder than absolute zero. So if you take the difference between “coldest possible temp” and “average summer temp”, then slice it in half, you’re getting temperatures that would kill most life on earth. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] frezik@midwest.social 2 points 2 years ago Just to nitpick, there are negative kelvins. I don't really understand it, myself, but I know it exists due to the specifics of how temperature is defined. Negative kelvins are actually extremely hot. permalink fedilink source parent [–] yetiftw@lemmy.world 0 points 2 years ago (2 children) just because it has a reason doesn't make it not arbitrary. you can ultimately come up with a reason for all arbitrary decisions permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] frezik@midwest.social 1 point 2 years ago (1 child) Is there a way to distinguish between arbitrary and non-arbitrary? Or is literally everything ever arbitrary? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] yetiftw@lemmy.world 1 point 2 years ago (1 child) literally every definition ever is arbitrary permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] frezik@midwest.social 1 point 2 years ago (1 child) Then what's the point of even calling it arbitrary? If it covers everything, then there's no reason for the word. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] yetiftw@lemmy.world 1 point 2 years ago that's not true. there are things that are not definitions. like my bed for instance, there are aspects that are arbitrary (my personal preferences, design choices, etc) and aspects that are not arbitrary (its physical form that exists beyond definition) permalink fedilink source parent [–] KairuByte@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 point 2 years ago (1 child) Do you not understand what the word arbitrary means?… permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] yetiftw@lemmy.world 1 point 2 years ago maybe you're the one who doesn't understand the ramifications of its meaning permalink fedilink source parent
[–] frezik@midwest.social 12 points 2 years ago (2 children) In short, you don't want to use a temperature scale with an arbitrary starting point for doing calculations like this. The freezing point of water is no more or less arbitrary than the freezing point of oxygen or sodium or anything else. It's just one that's somewhat useful for everyday use. When handling calculations for multiplying temperature, you want an absolute scale like Kelvin. Or Rankine if you're that kind of pervert. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] GrammarPolice@lemmy.world 2 points 2 years ago (1 child) What makes Kelvin absolute, and why is Celsius "wobbly"? I failed physics in high school permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Bumblefumble@lemm.ee 8 points 2 years ago* (1 child) 0 K is like when there is 0 heat basically, while celsius isn't. Imagine a unit for distance called "goob" where 0 goobs is 100 m and 1 goob is 115 m. In that case the goob unit would behave differently than a meter when you multiply and divide because 0 of the units don't actually correspond to "nothing" in a physical sense. That's exactly how the Celsius scale is, with zero being placed somewhere arbitrarily, not at a physical zero. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] lightsblinken@lemmy.world 4 points 2 years ago (1 child) i feel like i need more goob in my life. do you sell rulers? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Bumblefumble@lemm.ee 2 points 2 years ago Bit of an awkward scale for a ruler, but I can sell you one from -6.6666666.... to -6.65 goobs. permalink fedilink source parent [–] yetiftw@lemmy.world -4 points 2 years ago (1 child) absolute scales are still arbitrary. you would probably want to use a scale that measures "perceived heat" which is different than average kinetic energy permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] KairuByte@lemmy.dbzer0.com 3 points 2 years ago (2 children) Kelvin is just our word for it, but that is the point of “no heat”. It isn’t arbitrary, there is no “negative kelvin” just like you cannot make something colder than absolute zero. So if you take the difference between “coldest possible temp” and “average summer temp”, then slice it in half, you’re getting temperatures that would kill most life on earth. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] frezik@midwest.social 2 points 2 years ago Just to nitpick, there are negative kelvins. I don't really understand it, myself, but I know it exists due to the specifics of how temperature is defined. Negative kelvins are actually extremely hot. permalink fedilink source parent [–] yetiftw@lemmy.world 0 points 2 years ago (2 children) just because it has a reason doesn't make it not arbitrary. you can ultimately come up with a reason for all arbitrary decisions permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] frezik@midwest.social 1 point 2 years ago (1 child) Is there a way to distinguish between arbitrary and non-arbitrary? Or is literally everything ever arbitrary? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] yetiftw@lemmy.world 1 point 2 years ago (1 child) literally every definition ever is arbitrary permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] frezik@midwest.social 1 point 2 years ago (1 child) Then what's the point of even calling it arbitrary? If it covers everything, then there's no reason for the word. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] yetiftw@lemmy.world 1 point 2 years ago that's not true. there are things that are not definitions. like my bed for instance, there are aspects that are arbitrary (my personal preferences, design choices, etc) and aspects that are not arbitrary (its physical form that exists beyond definition) permalink fedilink source parent [–] KairuByte@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 point 2 years ago (1 child) Do you not understand what the word arbitrary means?… permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] yetiftw@lemmy.world 1 point 2 years ago maybe you're the one who doesn't understand the ramifications of its meaning permalink fedilink source parent
[–] GrammarPolice@lemmy.world 2 points 2 years ago (1 child) What makes Kelvin absolute, and why is Celsius "wobbly"? I failed physics in high school permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Bumblefumble@lemm.ee 8 points 2 years ago* (1 child) 0 K is like when there is 0 heat basically, while celsius isn't. Imagine a unit for distance called "goob" where 0 goobs is 100 m and 1 goob is 115 m. In that case the goob unit would behave differently than a meter when you multiply and divide because 0 of the units don't actually correspond to "nothing" in a physical sense. That's exactly how the Celsius scale is, with zero being placed somewhere arbitrarily, not at a physical zero. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] lightsblinken@lemmy.world 4 points 2 years ago (1 child) i feel like i need more goob in my life. do you sell rulers? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Bumblefumble@lemm.ee 2 points 2 years ago Bit of an awkward scale for a ruler, but I can sell you one from -6.6666666.... to -6.65 goobs. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Bumblefumble@lemm.ee 8 points 2 years ago* (1 child) 0 K is like when there is 0 heat basically, while celsius isn't. Imagine a unit for distance called "goob" where 0 goobs is 100 m and 1 goob is 115 m. In that case the goob unit would behave differently than a meter when you multiply and divide because 0 of the units don't actually correspond to "nothing" in a physical sense. That's exactly how the Celsius scale is, with zero being placed somewhere arbitrarily, not at a physical zero. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] lightsblinken@lemmy.world 4 points 2 years ago (1 child) i feel like i need more goob in my life. do you sell rulers? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Bumblefumble@lemm.ee 2 points 2 years ago Bit of an awkward scale for a ruler, but I can sell you one from -6.6666666.... to -6.65 goobs. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] lightsblinken@lemmy.world 4 points 2 years ago (1 child) i feel like i need more goob in my life. do you sell rulers? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Bumblefumble@lemm.ee 2 points 2 years ago Bit of an awkward scale for a ruler, but I can sell you one from -6.6666666.... to -6.65 goobs. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Bumblefumble@lemm.ee 2 points 2 years ago Bit of an awkward scale for a ruler, but I can sell you one from -6.6666666.... to -6.65 goobs. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] yetiftw@lemmy.world -4 points 2 years ago (1 child) absolute scales are still arbitrary. you would probably want to use a scale that measures "perceived heat" which is different than average kinetic energy permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] KairuByte@lemmy.dbzer0.com 3 points 2 years ago (2 children) Kelvin is just our word for it, but that is the point of “no heat”. It isn’t arbitrary, there is no “negative kelvin” just like you cannot make something colder than absolute zero. So if you take the difference between “coldest possible temp” and “average summer temp”, then slice it in half, you’re getting temperatures that would kill most life on earth. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] frezik@midwest.social 2 points 2 years ago Just to nitpick, there are negative kelvins. I don't really understand it, myself, but I know it exists due to the specifics of how temperature is defined. Negative kelvins are actually extremely hot. permalink fedilink source parent [–] yetiftw@lemmy.world 0 points 2 years ago (2 children) just because it has a reason doesn't make it not arbitrary. you can ultimately come up with a reason for all arbitrary decisions permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] frezik@midwest.social 1 point 2 years ago (1 child) Is there a way to distinguish between arbitrary and non-arbitrary? Or is literally everything ever arbitrary? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] yetiftw@lemmy.world 1 point 2 years ago (1 child) literally every definition ever is arbitrary permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] frezik@midwest.social 1 point 2 years ago (1 child) Then what's the point of even calling it arbitrary? If it covers everything, then there's no reason for the word. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] yetiftw@lemmy.world 1 point 2 years ago that's not true. there are things that are not definitions. like my bed for instance, there are aspects that are arbitrary (my personal preferences, design choices, etc) and aspects that are not arbitrary (its physical form that exists beyond definition) permalink fedilink source parent [–] KairuByte@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 point 2 years ago (1 child) Do you not understand what the word arbitrary means?… permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] yetiftw@lemmy.world 1 point 2 years ago maybe you're the one who doesn't understand the ramifications of its meaning permalink fedilink source parent
[–] KairuByte@lemmy.dbzer0.com 3 points 2 years ago (2 children) Kelvin is just our word for it, but that is the point of “no heat”. It isn’t arbitrary, there is no “negative kelvin” just like you cannot make something colder than absolute zero. So if you take the difference between “coldest possible temp” and “average summer temp”, then slice it in half, you’re getting temperatures that would kill most life on earth. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] frezik@midwest.social 2 points 2 years ago Just to nitpick, there are negative kelvins. I don't really understand it, myself, but I know it exists due to the specifics of how temperature is defined. Negative kelvins are actually extremely hot. permalink fedilink source parent [–] yetiftw@lemmy.world 0 points 2 years ago (2 children) just because it has a reason doesn't make it not arbitrary. you can ultimately come up with a reason for all arbitrary decisions permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] frezik@midwest.social 1 point 2 years ago (1 child) Is there a way to distinguish between arbitrary and non-arbitrary? Or is literally everything ever arbitrary? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] yetiftw@lemmy.world 1 point 2 years ago (1 child) literally every definition ever is arbitrary permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] frezik@midwest.social 1 point 2 years ago (1 child) Then what's the point of even calling it arbitrary? If it covers everything, then there's no reason for the word. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] yetiftw@lemmy.world 1 point 2 years ago that's not true. there are things that are not definitions. like my bed for instance, there are aspects that are arbitrary (my personal preferences, design choices, etc) and aspects that are not arbitrary (its physical form that exists beyond definition) permalink fedilink source parent [–] KairuByte@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 point 2 years ago (1 child) Do you not understand what the word arbitrary means?… permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] yetiftw@lemmy.world 1 point 2 years ago maybe you're the one who doesn't understand the ramifications of its meaning permalink fedilink source parent
[–] frezik@midwest.social 2 points 2 years ago Just to nitpick, there are negative kelvins. I don't really understand it, myself, but I know it exists due to the specifics of how temperature is defined. Negative kelvins are actually extremely hot. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] yetiftw@lemmy.world 0 points 2 years ago (2 children) just because it has a reason doesn't make it not arbitrary. you can ultimately come up with a reason for all arbitrary decisions permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] frezik@midwest.social 1 point 2 years ago (1 child) Is there a way to distinguish between arbitrary and non-arbitrary? Or is literally everything ever arbitrary? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] yetiftw@lemmy.world 1 point 2 years ago (1 child) literally every definition ever is arbitrary permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] frezik@midwest.social 1 point 2 years ago (1 child) Then what's the point of even calling it arbitrary? If it covers everything, then there's no reason for the word. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] yetiftw@lemmy.world 1 point 2 years ago that's not true. there are things that are not definitions. like my bed for instance, there are aspects that are arbitrary (my personal preferences, design choices, etc) and aspects that are not arbitrary (its physical form that exists beyond definition) permalink fedilink source parent [–] KairuByte@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 point 2 years ago (1 child) Do you not understand what the word arbitrary means?… permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] yetiftw@lemmy.world 1 point 2 years ago maybe you're the one who doesn't understand the ramifications of its meaning permalink fedilink source parent
[–] frezik@midwest.social 1 point 2 years ago (1 child) Is there a way to distinguish between arbitrary and non-arbitrary? Or is literally everything ever arbitrary? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] yetiftw@lemmy.world 1 point 2 years ago (1 child) literally every definition ever is arbitrary permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] frezik@midwest.social 1 point 2 years ago (1 child) Then what's the point of even calling it arbitrary? If it covers everything, then there's no reason for the word. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] yetiftw@lemmy.world 1 point 2 years ago that's not true. there are things that are not definitions. like my bed for instance, there are aspects that are arbitrary (my personal preferences, design choices, etc) and aspects that are not arbitrary (its physical form that exists beyond definition) permalink fedilink source parent
[–] yetiftw@lemmy.world 1 point 2 years ago (1 child) literally every definition ever is arbitrary permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] frezik@midwest.social 1 point 2 years ago (1 child) Then what's the point of even calling it arbitrary? If it covers everything, then there's no reason for the word. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] yetiftw@lemmy.world 1 point 2 years ago that's not true. there are things that are not definitions. like my bed for instance, there are aspects that are arbitrary (my personal preferences, design choices, etc) and aspects that are not arbitrary (its physical form that exists beyond definition) permalink fedilink source parent
[–] frezik@midwest.social 1 point 2 years ago (1 child) Then what's the point of even calling it arbitrary? If it covers everything, then there's no reason for the word. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] yetiftw@lemmy.world 1 point 2 years ago that's not true. there are things that are not definitions. like my bed for instance, there are aspects that are arbitrary (my personal preferences, design choices, etc) and aspects that are not arbitrary (its physical form that exists beyond definition) permalink fedilink source parent
[–] yetiftw@lemmy.world 1 point 2 years ago that's not true. there are things that are not definitions. like my bed for instance, there are aspects that are arbitrary (my personal preferences, design choices, etc) and aspects that are not arbitrary (its physical form that exists beyond definition) permalink fedilink source parent
[–] KairuByte@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 point 2 years ago (1 child) Do you not understand what the word arbitrary means?… permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] yetiftw@lemmy.world 1 point 2 years ago maybe you're the one who doesn't understand the ramifications of its meaning permalink fedilink source parent
[–] yetiftw@lemmy.world 1 point 2 years ago maybe you're the one who doesn't understand the ramifications of its meaning permalink fedilink source parent