GOAT but ...idk about influential... Let's just look at Haaland scoring a billion goals by being a world class poacher.. kind of like CR7 and being Haalands inspiration for how to move and get free space inside the box... How do you even get to what Messi does ? You look at Neymar skills and think ...I can try that... But how do you weave and wriggle in between 5 players with just body feints and make passes that splits the whole team in half ....every...single...match...
this post was submitted on 27 Nov 2023
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Respectfully if you think CR7 is just a poacher you have never seen him play. Agreed with your other points though.
If you’re talking about who was the most influential figure then it surely has to be Pele right? Countries stopped fighting just to see him play. Cruyff too.
Influential does not mean the best football player.
Why is he talking about Messi?
Messi might be the GOAT, but I don't think he has influenced much because no one can replicate what he has been doing.
Ronaldo on the other hand has. I don't wanna get into detail, but definitely around work ethic, taking care of your body etc And then you can definitely look at his positioning, how he is getting rid of defenders etc and take notes
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Obviously there's many ways to measure influence, but Franz Beckenbauer is worth a shout:
- As a player, one of the all-time greats
- Invented the libero position
- Also played in midfield with great success
- Captain of the first national team to win the Euros and the World Cup consecutively
- Captain of a Bayern team that won three consecutive European Cups
- Manager of World-Cup winning West German national side
- One of three people to win the World Cup both as player and manager
- Chair of Germany's winning bid to host the World Cup (yes, tainted by corruption)
I'd still give the nod to Cruyff, though.
"In the 1970s, I was a teenager in a country (Germany) that loved football – and in that country, there was no argument about who was the best player of all time. There was no contestation, no hierarchy, although there were many good players at the time. Franz Beckenbauer and Johan Cruyff were out of the ordinary. But even they never thought they could be the No. 1 player in the world. It was a time when the Ballon d'Or was reserved for players in Europe, so there was a very clear hierarchy: there were the very good ones, and there was the superstar. This is something we no longer have when discussing who is the best among several great players. None have the impact that Pelé had at the time."
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Get Messi’s meat out your mouth Arteta
Best probably, but there are more influential players. Ronaldinho and Ronaldo (R9) are more influential in terms of entertainment and inspiring people. Pele or Cruyff are probably #1 in how they changed the game.
Sorry Maradona is the OG
If Messi does things that no one else can, then he is certainly the least influential player ever in the history of football.
Do people only have one understanding of the word influence? I see a shitload of the discussion here saying that Messi hasn't been influential in regards to the sport as a whole, I don't see anyone discussing Messi's ability to influence what happens on a football pitch in any given game. He's easily one of the most influential players in the history of the sport in that sense.
Messi is the goat but I'd argue Pelé and Cruyff were FAR more influential to the sport than Messi. I don't think it's even close really.
I would argue Messi is more of an impactful player than influential.
You can copy Cruyff's philosophies and find moderate success, but it's near impossible to just copy Messi's playstyle.
I just want a coach/footballer to come out and say "Who? Messi? Never heard of him" or even a "Ye I could 1v1 that scrub, no talent" and farm clicks like crazy
Tapping him up? I like it
I'm not talking shit here, I genuinely think Cristiano Ronaldo us more influential.
Then it wouldn't make him influential. It just makes him one of a kind becuase of his playing style. There has never been a primary playmaker who also scores a lot of goals like he did, the only player who could have done that was Neymar. Ronaldo is also one a type given how much he scored playing from the wide position and only Mbappe does that, the early Liverpool version of Salah was a bit like that but he is much more playmaker these days. Its very hard for any teams to find another Ronaldo/Messi its not like basketball where Steph Curry revolutionized how teams thought of the 3 pointers and tried to play that way.
OK, for the sake of discussion, and this is something I’ve thought about: can we really say Messi is all that influential if what he can do cannot be replicated by anyone else? Not just the level of his individual skills, but having so many and how he combines them.
In my own personal experience, I’d say ronaldinho. I remember being a kid when he blew up and all of my friends wanted to juggle and dribble like him. The joy he had on his face when he played is something I’ll never forget.
How is this worthy of a post is the bigger question here