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[–] 126 points 10 months ago (3 children)

Long story short, if the Steam Machine gains enough market share, game publishers will want to join in because it will mean more money for them. It's all about money.

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  • [–] 4 points 10 months ago (1 child)

    I originally thought the Steam Deck would be enough for that, but it appears not yet. Maybe the combined share can move the needle

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  • [–] 114 points 10 months ago (3 children)

    My solution is simple: if it does not work on Linux, the game is out.

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  • [–] 14 points 10 months ago (1 child)

    Same. I didn't even move my Windows SSD over from my old computer. I wasn't using it before anyway, since a few years ago. Everything I play just mostly works in Linux now so what's the point. I didn't use Windows for anything else but Steam.

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    [–] 66 points 10 months ago (11 children)

    Kernel-level anti-cheat tools aren't even effective at stopping cheaters. They should just drop that dumb bullshit altogether.

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    [–] 55 points 10 months ago (8 children)

    Pretty much the answer I'd expect. In my most outlandish hopes, I'd love for this thing to serve as proper competition to the PS5, it's certainly more exciting than Xbox right now, and pretty much sounds like what MS is planning to try for the next Xbox anyway.

    That's probably not likely, that kind of threat would require some really aggressive pricing, and Valve can't guarantee as much vendor lock-in money post-sale as Sony can. That said... man it'd be incredible to see Valve step into that near-monopoly as well and viably compete against both Switch and PS5, as they both pretty desperately need competition to keep them working for the consumer.

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  • [–] 6 points 10 months ago (7 children)

    I agree it'll require aggressive pricing, and I'm also sure they know this. I think most of the predictions of price are too high. I won't be surprised if this is sold at a loss. Valve makes their money off the marketplace, not selling hardware. If they can move console players into their market, that'll provide huge returns.

    Consoles used to be sold at a loss. They don't now because they don't directly compete really. Either people get both or they choose based on brand loyalty or peer pressure. I hope Valve comes in and has a price so low you can't ignore it if you're looking to buy a console. The Xbox Series S is $400. I'm expecting it'll be the same at most, potentially even lower if it's sold at a loss. If it's $300 then they'll shake up the market without a doubt.

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  • [–] 9 points 10 months ago* (1 child)

    If they sold it a $400 they'd be at a loss, at $300 they would crash the desktop market. People would by it for general desktop use. Similar how so many PS2 were bought just because it was the cheapest DVD player and didn't buy games.

    Hell, there was a supercomputers built with PS3 clusters. Maybe that explains why the Steam Machine only has a 1Gbps nic...

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  • [–] 4 points 10 months ago

    I think the estimates are that $400 is reasonable for the hardware. It's not particularly great, and makes some sacrifices for cost saving, which is fine. Like 8GB VRAM is pretty low for modern hardware. It's enough for a lot of games, but modern AAA games it's probably a little low.

    I agree, $300 will be good enough people will get it for a computer. That's what selling at a cost does. These manufacturers already get a bulk discount that buying as a consumer doesn't, and selling it at cost makes it even lower. It'll definitely be a good value for low performance computing, and I'd wager that's part of the goal too. It isn't just a console. It's also an alternative to your computer and, importantly for Valve, gets you out of the MS ecosystem.

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  • [–] 6 points 10 months ago (3 children)

    Couldn't a problem be that If they set the price too low, companies buy them in bulk and using them as cheap, performant and sexy looking pcs? Consoles are very restricted in terms of os and other software, forcing people to use them in a way that almost guarantees you earning back your loss in the long term.

    Steam machines are the opposite, you can install virtually anything on it and use them for whatever.

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  • [–] 54 points 10 months ago*

    "We're expecting console numbers this time, and then they developers will have to support it."

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  • [–] 39 points 10 months ago (2 children)

    There's really nothing new, it's the same as it was on the Steam Deck.

    If the devs are not assholes they can easily allow Proton, from what Valve said before often all it takes is literally one checkbox on their side.

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  • [–] 36 points 10 months ago

    Kernel level anything is malware and should not be allowed to be sold.

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  • [–] 36 points 10 months ago (29 children)

    What kind of shit question is that???

    You should be questioning the game developers if they want to implement server side solutions instead of installing rootkits on users PCs and dictating what settings they should use.

    Fuck off Eurogamer. No game should require any sort of kernel level access or setting change on your PC.

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    [–] 34 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (17 children)

    It's just a skill issue on the part of the developers.

    Making anti-cheat properly is hard. Writing a spyware that watches everything that happens on your PC and blocks any attempts of touching the game is way easier, but bypassing that is easy with solutions that have higher privledges, thus being invisible even for the anti-cheat. You can just fake calls or hide memory from the anti-cheat, or just edit the anti-cheat in itself.

    The solution for that is to run anti-cheat in the highest possible permission - the kernel.

    Now, you could just make another kernel-level program that would have the same permissions to defeat that, or just edit your OS (i.e Linux, or a VM) where your cheat lives outside and has even higher privileges than the anti-cheat.

    This is where Windows comes in - the only way to run kernel code is to have it signed by Microsoft, and that certification process is extremely difficult and annoying, which puts a pretty big hurdle in front of cheat developers. It's the easy way out.

    You could also somehow reverse-engineer Windows and run a custom version to bypass this. And that's where TPM comes in, which (if I understood it right) validates that your Windows is the official signed one, and thus the kernel anti-cheat is safe. You can't have this kind of affirmation on Linux, and the lazy developers who don't want to invest into actual moderation and proper anti-cheat solutions just resort to kernel anti-cheat rootkit and require TPM to be enabled.

    There's not much Steam can do about this, aside from locking up their OS with signign keys and certification for priviliged software, along with setting up the whole TPM so you can't run modified versions, which isn't really possible since they are based on Linux.

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  • [–] 55 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (7 children)

    The solution for that is to run anti-cheat in the highest possible permission - the kernel.

    Cheaters just sidestep the kernel entirely and use DMA hardware instead.

    At the moment its rather expensive at ~$400 but prices will probably drop over time.

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  • [–] 33 points 10 months ago

    Oh, cool, so if I understand it right, you have a hardware that directly reads the physical memory, so you can access it unrestricted and undetectable from another PC, where the cheat runs, and then you use a HDMI fuser to merge the output of the game and the cheat that runs on the second PC on a single monitor.

    That's actually really clever, I love solutions like this. Not that I approve of cheating, I have 0 respect for people who (unconsesualy, as in all involved parties agree to it being allowed) cheat. But from the hardware/security point of view, it's amazing.

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  • [–] 6 points 10 months ago

    Oh, cool. Tbh I haven't really looked into cheats much, but I did briefly work in cybersecurity where I was doing malware development, where AV avoidance is basically the same problem as game cheats are dealing with, so I just extrapolated what I assumed works the same.

    This is a cool piece of tech, I'll look into it more. I like seeing new exploits, thanks!

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  • [–] 4 points 10 months ago (4 children)

    That's too complicated to teabag people in Battlefield, but what would I know about the scene I'm not a part of.

    Well, now I'm interested how far it can go in professional cheating. Any vids about that?

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  • [–] 9 points 10 months ago (3 children)
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    [–] 29 points 10 months ago* (6 children)

    Perhaps the issue is, partially, structural?

    I know some games are super competitive, but what if we generally went back to user hosted (and moderated) lobbies? They clean their own house. Some cheaters would get through, sure, but I feel like there's more social pressure not to cheat among a group of friends vs. raging strangers.

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  • [–] 16 points 10 months ago (1 child)

    "Kernel-level anti-cheat" is just a PR term for malware, change my mind.

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  • [–] 9 points 10 months ago (1 child)

    I remember buying a Steam Link directly from Valve back in the day for like $7 because of some sale they had. I really hope the same thing doesn't happen to the new Steam Machine

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  • [–] 4 points 10 months ago

    I think it would have to be wildly successful to achieve that goal but 🤞🤞

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