this post was submitted on 18 Jun 2023
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[–] [email protected] 8 points 1 year ago (1 children)

The question is, easily removable by the user or easily removable by a specialist with the right tools?

[–] [email protected] 6 points 1 year ago

I'm assuming somewhere in the middle leaning more toward easily user replaceable. The current crop of batteries are designed to be replaced by specialists with the right tools and the EU voted to depart from that.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 1 year ago (1 children)

That link is dead for me. I wonder what constitutes "removable". I'd honestly be fine if it still required a spludger, but it required them to make it easily accessable and not loaded down with glue once you're in. And make OEM batteries available for sale.

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[–] [email protected] 8 points 1 year ago

Good, it's a small victory but one step closer to a society that doesn't create waste just to buy the next new shiny toy. Products should be build to last, be easily repairable and create as little waste as possible (which isn't possible in a system that demands unlimited growth over anything else). If we want to have a somewhat ok climate in the future, just focusing on electric vehicles (which are doing the whole subscription to access your hardware fully, not easily repairable bs as well) isn't gonna cut it.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I might be in the minority here, but I feel this is actually a step back.

In the 5 years I've had my phone, there have been two times I've ever really needed to pull the battery, and still the hard reset sequence still eventually worked in both cases.

Anyone remember how some phones had issues with the battery door becoming somewhat loose over time, causing any slight bump to turn the phone off? Many have already commented on how they explode into multiple pieces when dropped. Traditionally the battery covers are incredibly flimsy plastic, even on flagship devices (cough Samsung). Waterproofing is a common concern too, however it actually can be done with a removable battery (e.g. Galaxy S5).

What really needed to be addressed here was how cumbersome it is to get into these devices to replace the battery, and how often people are price gouged to replace them. I believe this could have been better written to allow for either a removable battery, or a standardized and affordable built-in battery replacement process.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 1 year ago (2 children)

This will come into play at roughly the same time that solid state batteries will make battery replacement mostly irrelevant. We'll see some terrible designs to accommodate battery replacements that, for the most part, won't be used.

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[–] [email protected] 7 points 1 year ago (12 children)

I do miss being able to swap out a phone battery and this will certainly be a step in the right direction in terms ewaste and device longevity.

One thing that I wonder about is waterproofing or water resistance. Some phones are basically waterproof in shallow water. How achievable is this with a device with a trivial way to remove the battery?

[–] [email protected] 5 points 1 year ago

They can just seal the rest of the components exposing just a connection for the battery. There were water resistant phones before, the major reason they decided to make the battery unremovable was to make people buy new phones. Nobody wants to charge their phones multiple times a day.

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[–] [email protected] 6 points 1 year ago (1 children)

It might lead to thicker phones, but battery and/or SW obsolescence are the main reasons I have been swapping phone in the last 10 years.

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[–] [email protected] 6 points 1 year ago (3 children)

Although this is obviously a step in the right direction it needs to be followed up with security updates, no point increasing the life of the hardware without doing the same for the software.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Making it illegal to lock bootloaders would make each device community-maintainable.

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[–] [email protected] 6 points 1 year ago

Amen! Now let's see how Apple gets around that one too. :)

[–] [email protected] 6 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Now make SD cards mandatory and you've got something really good.

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[–] [email protected] 5 points 1 year ago (2 children)

Really hoping this happens. I want to be able to replace the battery on my phone after a year because the performance on the battery degraded by nearly half.

That being said, I'm also willing to bet some time shortly after this goes into affect, the cost of mobile service (at least in the US) will go up another $10/$15 a month, and phones will increase in cost by another $100-$200. Not because materials cost more, or designs change. But to preemptively screw people over.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 1 year ago (2 children)

on the battery degraded by nearly half.

One year nearly half ? wtf , even my 24/7 power used phone lost approx only 17% on battery health and its a Poco x3 pro

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[–] [email protected] 5 points 1 year ago (1 children)

And now they just have to force manufacturers to either at least security patch devices for, let's say 10 years, or force them to open source everything the community needs to continue supporting this device. It never happened to me that the battery died before support ended.

Just had that issue with my Pixel 3a XL. No more security updates. Had to replace it with a Pixel 6a but I liked the 3a XL more. It there was any community support for the 3a XL, I would rather sell my 6a again.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 1 year ago

As an Apple user, I definitely have batteries die before the product stops being useful. The company provides feature updates for old phones for several years, and when that runs out they continue to provide security patches for several more years.

A new iPhone battery is only $47 (if you do the repair yourself, and if you send your old battery back to Apple for a recycling credit), but it's a pretty complex and arduous process with a fair chance of damaging your phone while attempting it.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 1 year ago

I love reading such headlines, really glad there's an entity that can enforce such rules on manufacturers, at least when they're looking after us

[–] [email protected] 5 points 1 year ago (4 children)

I'm curious to see what this will mean for phone designs & dust/waterproof ratings. Either way, it only takes effect in 2027 so that should give some time for innovation rather than falling back on plastic clamshells of yore.

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[–] [email protected] 5 points 1 year ago (7 children)

How is this a win? My non-Android device is at 89% health after 5 years. I’m not going to replace the battery, I’m going to replace the device.

I’d prefer that we get paid $20 to recycle an old phone so that they actually get recycled.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 1 year ago

Because you are an outlier when it comes to most people's experience of battery life in their phones.

The recycling scheme is a good idea too, we should do both.

Reducing is just as important as recycling. And reducing the amount of people buying new phones because their battery dies is a win.

Also there are these well-used battery recycling boxes in plenty shops where I'm from. If people could remove their phone battery, they might still throw away their phone, as there's not as obvious, easy and visible a recycling system for those yet, but perhaps some might at least take out the battery first and chuck it in the recycling bin next time they go to shop.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 1 year ago (4 children)

How is it a loss for you in any way? Just because the battery can be replaced more easily doesn't mean you have to replace it if you're at 89% after 5 years. I use my phone a lot and burn through batteries in 18-24 months. This shouldn't have any effect on people who only have light usage like you but benefit the rest of us tremendously.

It'd be like only driving 1,000 miles a year and saying there's no need to make oil changes easier to accomplish. Some of use have to change it orders of magnitude more frequently than you and would appreciate not having to disassemble the whole front of our cars to do it.

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[–] [email protected] 6 points 1 year ago (5 children)

Because not everyone has the same anecdotal experience as you?

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[–] [email protected] 5 points 1 year ago (6 children)

Misleading title. Phones can still be glued. Waterproof phones still don't need to have a user replaceable battery (the battery needs to be replaceable but by professionals).

[–] [email protected] 5 points 1 year ago (3 children)

Do you have a reference for that? From all the documentation I've seen elsewhere, that's not true. There's no exclusion for waterproof devices, and everything has to be possible with tools a normal person can buy (you might need to go to a local hardware store, but no unique specialist expensive kit).

The full law is here: https://www.europarl.europa.eu/RegData/docs_autres_institutions/commission_europeenne/com/2020/0798/COM_COM(2020)0798_EN.pdf. It only mentions 'water' 3 times and none of them relate to waterproof phones (they're talking about batteries of waterbourne transport & environmental impact of water use) so I don't know where that's coming from.

It's totally possible to make waterproof phones with removable batteries - Samsung did it with the Galaxy S5 (IP67 - 1 meter under water for 30 minutes) way back in 2014 and there's lots of other examples. It's just not quite as cheap as glueing everything together.

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