this post was submitted on 02 Dec 2023
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Russian security forces raided gay clubs and bars across Moscow Friday night, less than 48 hours after the country’s top court banned what it called the “global LGBTQ+ movement” as an extremist organization.

Police searched venues across the Russian capital, including a nightclub, a male sauna, and a bar that hosted LGBTQ+ parties, under the pretext of a drug raid, local media reported.

Eyewitnesses told journalists that clubgoers’ documents were checked and photographed by the security services. They also said that managers had been able to warn patrons before police arrived.

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[–] [email protected] 12 points 11 months ago (5 children)

Here's the thread I made on Hexbear.

https://hexbear.net/post/1232126

Four comments as of me writing this comment:

Putin really is a big fan of the Russian Empire. He's even doing his own pogroms that will inevitably lead to a brain drain.

Russia is so fucked. People who identified as not-religious has been constantly falling from since 1991 from 60% to 20%. Orthodox Christianity from 30% to 70%. Russian youth (16-29 yo) are 75% religious (62% orthodox) https://www.pewresearch.org/religion/2014/02/10/russians-return-to-religion-but-not-to-church/

Man, fuck Gorbachev for allowing the USSR to be dissolved by the west.

[an emoji titled "russia-cool", depicting a burning Russian flag]

So yeah, if you're looking for Hexbears criticizing Russia, then there you go.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 11 months ago (1 children)

Also, if you are Russian LGBT you need to leave the country NOW. Germany is taking in asylums so there’s a way out.

I'm confused. Don't they want to leave Nato countries? Why not go to the next best thing to them, China?

[–] [email protected] 0 points 11 months ago (1 children)

I can only assume it's for reasons such as:

Language: there is a very large Russian/FSU diaspora in Germany, while there is only a very small Russian community in China; and LGBT+ Russians are more likely to be proficient in English than in Chinese. It then follows that integrating into society and accessing services would be easier in Germany than in China, since Germany has a high English proficiency, and a large enough Russian population for many services to be provided in that language, or for Russophones to be able to find community on the basis of shared first language. German itself, of course, is also more similar to English and Russian than it is to Chinese.

The state of LGBT+ rights: rights for LGBT+ people are better in Germany than in China. This is not to erase the strides that China has made in terms of LGBT+ rights, nor the difficulties that LGBT+ people face in Germany and the very real possibility of regression as right-wing sentiment grows in Germany; but it's also just a fact that LGBT+ Hexbears obviously acknowledge, that it's in many ways just easier to be LGBT+ in the core than in the periphery or semi-periphery. It sucks, but that's the way it is, for now.

Ease of applying for asylum: becoming a refugee in China is more difficult than becoming a refugee in Germany. Last I checked, China does not officially grant asylum, and has all refugees living in the country processed by the UNHCR. Germany, on the other hand, does grant asylum. While it's obviously a good thing that people can flee from dangerous situations and seek asylum in another country, and China really should grant official asylum to refugees; one should be aware that systemically, the imperial core's policy towards refugees is a form of economic domination over the imperial periphery, meant to provide themselves with cheap labor and drain the capital of the periphery.

China does not need more communists: it's not like it's a bad thing to move to China by any means — there's a lot of good that can be done there — but it's also not a bad thing to move to the imperial core in order to fight the good fight "in the heart of the enemy". That's more people to do activism, more people to join and contribute to organizations, and so forth: if we want to build socialism around the whole world, obviously we'll want to live around the whole world.


I dunno, these are just some of my thoughts on potential reasons why an LGBT+ Russian socialist might prefer to take refuge in Germany rather than China... Like, it could've also just been that Kaplya just stated the name of the first country Kaplya thought of, and the comment wasn't meant to be read into to this extent, but either way it's a good writing exercise.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago)

Or, you know, it's because nobody wants to immigrate to China? Ever notice that unlike Europe and Canada and Australia and the US, China doesn't have an immigration problem? I wonder why that is?

In case anyone wants to know, there have been over 40k undocumented Chinese immigrants to the US this year alone, and the numbers are growing. Fortunately they are pretty easily able to claim asylum and are easily integrated into existing Chinese-American communities.

It's so strange that we don't see any Americans immigrating to China.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 11 months ago (1 children)

Man, fuck Gorbachev for allowing the USSR to be dissolved by the west.

What on Earth does this even mean?

[–] [email protected] 4 points 11 months ago

No idea. Letter from mental asylum?

[–] [email protected] 5 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago) (1 children)

Seems like they are mostly concerned with connecting "Russia bad" to liberalism, the ideology which is actually doing the most for LGBT rights. So even in contrition, they push misinformation and information warfare.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago) (3 children)

liberalism, the ideology which is actually doing to most for LGBT rights.

Just so that you're aware: liberalism here refers to the belief in market economies and the right to private property. There is a bit more to liberalism, naturally, but that's the main point. So whenever you see Hexbears talk about "libs" or "liberals", rather than applying whatever American definition or preconception of the word "liberalism" that you may have, instead think, "someone who supports the free market and private property"... And indeed, the liberal parties in Russia are right-wing and deeply conservative: "liberal" non est "progressive". Decouple those terms in your mind. You can have liberal progressives and liberal conservatives alike if you're not using "liberal" as a synonym of "progressive", like Americans tend to do.

Furthermore, LGBT+ criticisms of capitalism have a history stretching back even before Stonewall. Harry Whyte's letter to Stalin in 1934, which criticizes the regress of gay rights in the USSR while also analyzing the position of gays in capitalism at the time, stands out. Leslie Feinberg (1949-2014) is another important figure in the history of LGBT+ communism. You might find Feinberg's Lavender and Red to be particularly interesting, as it lays out a history of the intersection of LGBT+ rights movements and leftism.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago) (2 children)

Just so you're aware: liberalism is the European enlightenment philosophy which holds that individual liberty and civil freedom is foundational to the curation of political agency and democratic self determination. This ML reduction to "liberalism is everything I don't like" is factually incorrect and, like I said, intentional misinformation. Or more realistically, just bad political science, which is what most of us have come to expect from hexbears.

Russian oligarchy is in no way, shape, or form related to the belief that democracy is sacred, and political agency is a necessary condition thereof.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 11 months ago (1 children)

I think they were referring to difference between classical liberalism (usually implied by "liberalism" term in Europe) and social liberalism (usually implied in the US). The European enlightenment philosophy sounds like something that was a basis for both but contemporary state may be far from the original ideals.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 11 months ago

Either way they're still full of shit, so I don't see that it even matters.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 11 months ago

But the right to private property is as important as the right to your bodily autonomy! If you can own nothing then prepare to die losing your body and your mind. Imagine that, a communist alien that will take everything, even your mind from you!

The blob will have no mercy on us! Burn it to death with fire if we have to

[–] [email protected] 3 points 11 months ago (1 children)

Just so that you're aware, that's a bullshit definition of liberalism and no one is under any obligation to cede it to authoritarian liars and chumps. Any legitimate definition of liberalism has also to include a fundamental respect for basic human rights and the consent of the governed. Liberalism stands in antithesis to authoritarianism and that's precisely why the hexbear bozos hate it so much.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 11 months ago

How exactly do I revoke my consent?

[–] [email protected] 2 points 11 months ago

So they're not even consistent and you trot that out like we're supposed to somehow respect it? Call it what it is; intellectual dishonesty. Those people are intellectual contortionists because they don't actually have a coherent ideology that's defensible in the light of basic human rights. It's all authoritarian bullshit and the sooner you realize that, the better off you'll be.