So I've been doing subcutaneous E injections for close to 11 months at this point¹, and my most recent one turned out kinda weird. It hurt a bit more than usual going in, there was a lot less resistance when pushing the plunger in (got everything injected in less time than normal), and there was significantly more blood than I'm used to after removing the needle (typically there's only a tiny speck if anything, this time nearly the entire cotton part of the band-aid is stained red). It's been about 2 days now and there's a ~1cm diameter bruise at the injection spot, which is also something I haven't seen before.

The only thing I can think of is that I must've gotten unlucky and managed to hit a blood vessel. If that is the case though, my understanding of how injections work tells me that this will dramatically affect the release curve - rather than being deposited into fat tissue and slowly being released into the bloodstream, I assume this would mean much of the EEn was dumped directly into the blood where it would then be converted into E2 and consumed/destroyed within hours or a few days at most. Am I overthinking this? Should I do another shot to make sure my levels don't crash down in case my hypothesis is correct, or should I just stick to my usual weekly schedule?

¹ probably not relevant, but including this anyway: I'm injecting 0.13 mL of EEn (40 mg/mL, in MCT oil) once per week using 30G, 1/2in long needles

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[–] [S] 7 points 1 day ago* (4 children)

thanks for the response :3

honestly the other user's comment freaked me out and i ended up reposting this to a bunch of places (asking both my original question and how reasonable the other response was), and so far all the other responses i've gotten back have been either "that seems totally within the range of normal" or "probably not a problem, maybe consider having it looked at if the bruising gets worse or it starts hurting", alongside a healthy smattering of "wow that person is way overreacting".

that said, i do appreciate y'all's concern and somewhat more critical take, and agree that it'd rather not take any unnecessary risks (even though it's pretty unlikey to be ER-worthy and jumping directly to cardiac tissue necrosis is most definitely an overreaction).

i think i'll go ahead and treat this as "potentially serious, but not urgent": my next step (after i sleep, because it is now 2:45am and i am still winding down from the brief adrenaline shot of "fuck do i have to go to the ER") is gonna be to shoot an email to this one doctor (not mine) a few towns over who i've heard is very actively supportive of DIY, and see if he has anything to say or knows who i should reach out to. and failing that, i have a few other potential local contacts who might be able to help me get in touch with doctors who won't be weird about me injecting myself with graymarket estrogen without medical supervision.

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  • [–] 6 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (2 children)

    with regards to the other user's comment, they are not wrong in that there are medications that can cause tissue necrosis, and this being the circulatory system that can include the heart.

    but in re estradiol specifically (and steroids in general), we tried looking but weren't able to reach any meaningful conclusion about any tissue necrosis.

    there doesn't look to be much literature surrounding this topic, at least that we could find anyways. there is this review, which provides examples of medications that while causing pain and discomfort when accidentally injected into a vessel otherwise did not result in considerable complications. there are of course other cases with other medications that went far worse, but notably there didn't look to be any steroidal medications among them. the only thing we can really conclude is that tissue necrosis in the heart is not a given. but this doesn't mean it's out of the question entirely either.

    this tutorial about accidental intra-arterial injections states:

    Whilst the exact pathophysiology is unclear (and likely varies by drug) thrombosis is believed to represent a final common pathway. This may then lead to tissue ischaemia and necrosis.

    the whole thing appears to be a very broad generalization, one that surrounds a) some medications often used in hospitals and what to do if a medic mistakenly injects something into a vessel, and b) illicit drug use. but again, there is nothing in specific about estradiol or any steroids.

    otherwise the most specific stuff we could find were anecdotes from online forums, which frequently mentioned elevated heartrate, it feeling awful in general, but often not being problematic beyond that. most of these accounts were about testosterone, which is a different drug, but it is also a steroid; the number of molecules injected was also more numerous than you would ever do in pretty much all of those internet posts we read.

    there isn't a satisfying answer—there is only a considerable lack of information. with what little is out there though, we'd guess that you won't die and that you might be just fine given some time and caution, albeit getting checked out by a medical professional is still a good idea. well either that or more likely from your description you just punctured a vessel of some kind.

    stay safe, stay comfy, and keep calm!

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  • [–] [S] 3 points 1 day ago (1 child)

    wow, what a thoroughly researched comment, thanks so much for digging all that up! even if there doesn't seem to be much existing research wrt. estradiol, i now A) have an understanding of what they were getting at, and B) have quite a few specific things to ask the doctor.

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  • [–] 2 points 20 hours ago*

    thank you!! we would not call it thorough by any means, but then again anything evidence-based goes a long way compared to pure conjecture, i.e. so much of the internet. we just wanna make the world a better place.

    on a more personal level we'd say we absolutely disparage fearmongering and saying scary stuff to get someone/many to do stuff, even if it is good stuff. the stress and fear associated with a blown-out concern can in the end be harder to deal with than the concern itself, and leads to real difficulties for all involved! hell, being frequently stressed for extended periods of time is a proven health risk. stress has its valid places but we shouldn't try and cause undue amounts of it.

    please do be curious though, we like super admire that. best wishes <3

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  • [–] 4 points 1 day ago*

    I agree with the top comment of this thread. I had an injection the other night that hurt more than usual and some of the actual liquid pushed back out the injection site. Still a bit sore a day later. I just didn’t fully relax my leg I think. Something like that. Some combo of not getting the needle far enough and my leg being a bit tense. I was kind of rushing so maybe that’s part of it. Wasn’t really able to do the regular ritual.

    Definitely monitor and such. Doesn’t seem so out of the ordinary that you need to out yourself to you doctor right away, but seek medical attention if it doesn’t improve from how you described it. Like bruising hopefully starts to fade from here on out.

    Could go to an urgent care or something that isn’t your doc?? Just say it happened with your prescribed meds or something. Should be able to keep those records separate if you play your cards right. Some folks might have thoughts on that for other reasons, but it’s always something I keep in the back of my head if I am ever doing DIY.

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