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Anon ruins christmas (thelemmy.club)
submitted 2 months ago by [M] to c/greentext@sh.itjust.works
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[–] 6 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (15 children)

99.9% of people are agnostic atheists, so for this argument

thus Atheism and Religion both make conclusions without evidence

No they don't

While I support freedom of religion, given the harms religion has done over history, I prefer atheism

So you're an atheist :) Welcome to the club!

Sadly you'll now have to find a tree with an angel on it and replace it with a bunsen burner, those are the rules of the atheism belief system 😅

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  • [–] 2 points 2 months ago

    Sadly you'll now have to find a tree with an angel on it and replace it with a bunsen burner, those are the rules of the atheism belief system 😅

    A festivus pole is fine as well.

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  • [–] 1 point 2 months ago (6 children)

    That picture is reductive to the point of misleading. Atheism makes no claims or beliefs. Atheism simply says that claims made without evidence can be dismissed without consideration. Theists claim god(s) exist. Atheism says without evidence I can disregard that claim as nonsense.

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  • [–] 0 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (2 children)

    What are you confused about in particular?

    Atheism makes no claims or beliefs

    It depends on your definition of atheist, I mean the picture is right there and right above it is someone explaining the concept further, I don't know what you gained from vomiting out something directly addressed in my own post and right above it

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  • [–] 0 points 2 months ago (1 child)

    It's the only definition of atheist. Atheism makes no claims. Theists and anti-theists make claims. Atheism consists entirely and completely of the position that claims made without evidence can be dismissed without consideration. That's it. That's all. It's basic logic.

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  • [–] -1 points 2 months ago (2 children)

    Atheism makes no claims or beliefs. Atheism simply says that claims made without evidence can be dismissed without consideration.

    You're thinking empiricism. Atheism is most fundamentally the belief that there is not a god. There are atheist positions that are consistent with empiricism, but not all of them are, nor do they need to be.
    There are gradients to it, but atheism is fundamentally about belief. The rational for that belief is a different set of philosophy.

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  • [–] 0 points 2 months ago (1 child)

    Requiring evidence of a thing before acknowledging its existence isn't about belief in any way, belief isn't relevant to facts or evidence. Atheism is not believing in something that has no evidence. Lack of belief isn't belief. Theological philosophy asserts atheism is as you say, but that's in the context of theological philosophy. I'm an atheist and I do not believe there are no gods, I do not believe in anything. There's either evidence of a thing or there isn't. Theists: there's a god! Atheists: pics or it didn't happen.

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  • [–] 0 points 2 months ago

    You're conflating "belief" with "faith". One is about what you accept as true without evidence, and the other is about what you simply hold to be true.
    If someone said "there is no god", I would take that as a true statement. I believe it to be a true statement because the positive assertion that there is has not met the burden of proof.

    The usage of evidence to guide belief is empiricism, and that's not a theological philosophy, it's the basis of the scientific method. Empiricism isn't a prerequisite for atheism because they're different topics. It's entirely possible to be an atheist for reasons that have nothing to do with a lack of evidence. Asserting that atheism is about not believing things without evidence is fundamentally misrepresenting the broad meaning of the word and substituting your specific philosophy as the main interpretation.

    I do not believe in anything

    Okay.

    There's either evidence of a thing or there isn't.

    Can you provide me with evidence that that statement is true? Without tying a logical knot?

    Empiricism is itself a belief in the sense that you meant it. You cannot have evidence for the validity of evidence without first accepting that evidence lends credence to a notion.

    That being said: rewind and reread what I said but take the word belief as "agreeing with the truth of the statement". The existence of a deity is a binary. Ignoring questions of "why" one accepts a statement, one either accepts a statement, accepts it's opposite, or rejects the premise entirely. The conventional empirical agnostic atheist stance is to believe there is no deity because the question is not really knowable, and a claim should be disbelieved without proportional evidence. Belief that there is no god is not the blind assertion that there isn't one. It just means that's the state of affairs of reality as far as you know.

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  • [–] -4 points 2 months ago (6 children)

    thus Atheism and Religion both make conclusions without evidence

    No they don’t

    What, just trust you bro?

    So you’re an atheist :) Welcome to the club!

    Not cool. I am that which I am, and chose not to say what that is. This is like telling a Jew they're a Christian because the old testament is heavily cribbed from Jewish texts.

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  • [–] 6 points 2 months ago (4 children)

    Not cool. I am that which I am, and chose not to say what that is

    If you do not believe in a god, you are an atheist, I'm sorry that offends you but that is literally the definition

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  • [–] 1 point 2 months ago* (3 children)

    Didn't say I don't believe in god, said there is no evidence.

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  • [–] 1 point 2 months ago

    This is like telling a Jew they're a Christian because the old testament is heavily cribbed from Jewish texts.

    Not quite. It's like telling someone who says they're Jewish, that Christ was the true savior and son of God, and that he brought a new covenant that comes before the covenant formed with moses that they're describing Christianity.

    That's exaggerating the point, but my meaning is that while your beliefs are your's and it's rude to correct someone on them, the word used to describe those beliefs can be much more readily discussed.

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