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This is 2026 (thelemmy.club)
submitted 5 months ago by to c/politicalmemes@lemmy.world
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[–] 33 points 5 months ago (26 children)

It is very naïve to assume racism only belonged to the Confederacy. Just because black folks were free in the North, doesn't mean it was all sunshine and roses. This was inevitable from America's founding as a white nation. It's a sad, hapless truth; one that, as every society has, will bring us to collapse. So, stock up, play nice with neighbors, and ride out the fall of America.

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  • [–] 18 points 5 months ago (3 children)

    On the scale of racists, I'll take the ones that are ashamed of being that way over the loudly and proudly defiant ones.

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  • [–] 3 points 5 months ago (2 children)

    Were they ashamed when they segregated the black people? Were they ashamed when they economically crippled them at every turn? Were they ashamed when they made them sit in the back of their churches? Were they ashamed when they were forced to go to their own people's colleges and universities, because they weren't allowed admittance to the white school? This all happened in the north post Civil War. This was the endgame of America. Always has been and it's been known since the beginning. It's time to just sit back and watch the collapse of the empire. Nothing else to do. Racism will never fully be extinguished because it preys on our tribalistic instinct. Hard to overwrite that one.

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  • [–] 4 points 5 months ago (1 child)

    Racism as a concept was invented in the 1700’s by rich, white Europeans. It has nothing to do with humans existing in tribes and can absolutely be extinguished.

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  • [–] -4 points 5 months ago

    That 1700s example is something hotly debated by historians and anthropologists. So, I'm not going to touch on it. My point was that humans innately need/want a tribe. Some humans now, use race in place of a tribe. Others use nationality. Some use religion. It's all the same. This was always the endgame. There is no other outcome. You will never be able to move past it. To think so, is naïveté. Because there will always be a group in the shadows waiting to strike and poison the well.

    It just doesn't matter, dude. We as humanity deserve to die regardless. As a species we're absolutely useless to this Earth. We're selfish, narcissistic people. We're animals. We make choices based on how it can help our people first, not others. It has been this way since the start of society.

    P.S. I will add that, racism is always discrimination, but discrimination isn't always racism. As such, it doesn't matter if it's called racism, or not. It's discrimination rooted from a tribalistic us v them ideology.

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  • [–] 14 points 5 months ago (19 children)

    Bro you're not teaching anything anyone just being annoying. Yes, Lincoln and the rest of the North was racist, everybody knows that. But they still gave African-Americans the right to vote because they believed in democracy. The confederacy started a war to stop Black people from voting. There was a palpable difference. We don't need racists to start liking minorities, we need democracy and freedom protected for all. And yes we should have hanged confederate leaders and this country would be decades more advanced right now.

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  • [–] 2 points 5 months ago* (2 children)

    Considering some of Europe started adopting some form of universal healthcare in the 1940s, that's ~8 decades and counting, just for that one milestone of modern civilization.

    We cant even get away from lead waterpipes and asbestos schools.

    There are starving children in Africa* with better access to healthcare, clean water, and an education.

    Oh, and internet.

    * By American definition of "starving", so like, ~1800kcal per day.

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  • [–] -1 points 5 months ago (1 child)

    But like, there is starvation in Africa. I am being pedantic, but it's worth not forgetting about the current Sudan situation.

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  • [–] 3 points 5 months ago

    There's starvation in America, too.

    Maybe the 80s were more prosperous, but that's what our parents would tell us millenials when we were kids who didn't finish their dinner. We also sat Indian-style and played Chinese Kickball. It was a different time.

    But kids today, we may as well just tell them that there are starving kids in their classroom...because there more than likely are.

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  • [–] 0 points 5 months ago (15 children)

    It was very nice to give them the right to vote, as long as they stayed far enough away from the whites. I'm just saying, it's naïve to say that this level of racism was only fostered from the Confederacy. It's tribalism. The most exceptional part of the human race. It's what kept us alive long enough to evolve this way. Every single one of us is sucept to it. To think not is folly, friend. You have a level of anger in your heart that is best put aside for a sandwich with a friend. The world has not changed, it has always been this way. How you choose to react is your own. Peace and love to you.

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  • [–] 10 points 5 months ago (5 children)

    I get your point, but calling them the same is not accurate. The idea of the south was that black people were not people, and should only be counted for property.

    You can still be racist and think that black people are people, but there's levels to it, it's not an on or off thing.

    This said, it's not representative of the whole south or the whole north, but the variance was absolutely enough to make progress.

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  • [–] -4 points 5 months ago (4 children)

    I think the fundamental disagreement we have is, you have faith in progress; and I am jaded.

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  • [–] 5 points 5 months ago* (3 children)

    Oh believe me I'm jaded as well. What we have going on right now is the opposite of progress. We're headed toward fascism on a global scale. We're already balls deep in the US.

    I still think it's important to call out the positives, even in a flawed setting because that can give a glimmer of hope, and without hope we'd just surrender. Fuck that. I'm too petty for that, and wrong is wrong.

    It's all the same or that's not good enough or it could have been better shouldn't get in the way of progress no matter how small. The difference between the north and south in that time may seem small now, but it was a massive difference for those that were affected. It was the catalyst that got us to the point we were at a decade ago (prior to the maga shift) which compared to north or south of the time is a monumental difference. Even a decade ago, we were no where near finished, but it was progress.

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  • [–] -4 points 5 months ago (2 children)

    What is the difference between enslaving someone from not viewing them as equal and setting their house on fire with them in it, for not viewing them as equal? You bring up recent history saying things were getting better, even ten years ago. I disagree. The thing that brought it back out was electing a black president. And all those with racism in their hearts saw it as the end for them. So, they're gonna make everyone pay for that. Because America has always been racist. It will never stop until whites in america are the minority.

    If you think it was better, you missed the part where we vehemently imposed cruelty on Arabs in the past three decades.

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  • [–] 4 points 5 months ago* (8 children)

    it’s naïve to say that this level of racism was only fostered from the Confederacy

    It's not naive because Northen racism still fought a war to give African-Americans the right to be citizens. It objectively did not rise to the level of taking those voting rights away, which is what OP is about. Those are two distinct levels of racism is what I'm saying.

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  • [+] -6 points 5 months ago (7 children)

    But you're rewriting history. They still burned black people inside their homes. They lynched. They segregated. They did all the horrific things. But you want to draw the line and say that they were better because they gave them citizenship? How'd that citizenship work out when trying to get a job?There were plenty of sharecroppers stuck on farms for money they couldn't spend anywhere else. But hey! At least they could vote! America is a racist country through and through. Stop acting like it's not, y'all.

    If you want to ignore the blatant racism of the America since it's founding, you can. But don't act like America has gotten better. It still hates the minority, I.e. not whites.

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  • [–] 5 points 5 months ago (6 children)

    Idk i wrote several times it's racist idk how much more i need to break it down for you

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  • [–] -3 points 5 months ago (5 children)

    I don't know, I wrote down several times that black people died and you're dismissive of it, because at least they freed em first. I don't know how much more I can break it down.

    You're not actually responding with rebuttals, you're just saying naïvely, "north freed black people. Doesn't matter how many died from racist attacks and infrastructure. Because they fought to free them." that's insane logic. The north made few steps to prevent discrimination against blacks, even preventing them from voting in some areas. The rest of the country did too, I wonder why? Maybe it's because america is a country founded on racism. Or more accurately discrimination of the unseemly. The unwanted. The outcasts of society. It was blacks, Jews, Irish, Italians, Polish, Arabians, southeast Asians, Indians, American Indians. The list goes on.

    We will always have racism and I wish I had your optimism. It's admirable. But I have seen far too much of the horrors of the world up close, to ever believe humanity will get better. I'm sorry you weren't able to convince me, and I you. I hope you are able to see the future you yearn for.

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  • [–] 4 points 5 months ago (4 children)

    Well I mean how could I ever convince you if you make up quotes i never said. You're just talking past me. Have a nice life.

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  • [–] -3 points 5 months ago (3 children)

    make up quotes about me what an actual child, you are. Here's the actual quote.

    It's not naive because Northen racism still fought a war to give African-Americans the right to be citizens.

    It's not naïve to say that we would still have the level of racism today, when after they fought that war to give African Americans the right to be citizens? When those same soldiers killed black people? When they kept them out of schools and churches? You're still ignoring the point, my friend. How about another quote?

    ...democracy and freedom for all

    you said this as your main sticking point for the difference. Where is the freedom in segregation? Where is the democracy in intentional economic hardship? Where is the democracy in lynchings?

    You are quite welcome to keep your whitewashed history of the US. Good luck overcoming the fascism with that one. Your country can't even agree on your own history and you hope to be condescending? Truly it is a wonder how Donald Trump got elected in your country.

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  • [–] 4 points 5 months ago (2 children)

    Lol so you're not even in the US trying to teach me about my own lived reality in the US. It all makes sense now.

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  • [–] -3 points 5 months ago* (1 child)

    Nah, born and raised in the US. But I pledge allegiance to no government.

    Edit: you just struck me as a nationalist, so I figured I would appeal to that by saying your country. you gotta be nationalist to ignore the history of the country.

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  • [–] 2 points 5 months ago (1 child)

    racism was thier SOLE mission, beliefs, of course it was also in the north. but it fuel thier economy in thier south through segregaiton and slavery. the problem was not ELIMINATING the remaining confederacy strongholds.

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  • [–] -4 points 5 months ago

    *Their.

    Segregation was common across across the whole country. This whole country has always been racist. My point was this wasn't a north south issue. It is the heart of America. What does it matter if we give people freedom and still starve them? What good is freedom if you have no home? What good is freedom if you're still burning them? This is wasn't progress in the north, it was trying to feign righteousness. America, all of it, is a racist country.

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