submitted 3 weeks ago* (last edited 3 weeks ago) by to c/askchapo@hexbear.net
 

I gave up on ethical consumption, and I want to explain why.

I don't come from a particularly wealthy family, and I work an ordinary job. But when I was a teenager, I spent a surprising amount of time thinking about ethical consumption. I'm not even sure what initially pushed me toward it. We hear about the problems of consumerism and exploitation all the time, and this isn't exactly a new issue.

Whenever I saw news about labor exploitation in manufacturing, for example in the clothing industry, I obviously didn't support it. Especially as a worker myself, the idea of someone being exploited to produce something I buy has always bothered me.

For a long time, I tried to buy only from so-called responsible or ethical producers and to avoid mass-market brands whenever possible.

Eventually, I realized that I simply cannot afford to live this way.

I understood this particularly well a few months ago, when I decided that I wanted to become vegetarian for ethical reasons and stop eating meat. I quickly ran into a very practical problem: a lot of the products marketed toward vegetarians are simply too expensive for me.

There is a bio supermarket in my city where I can barely afford to buy anything. The prices are genuinely enormous from my perspective. Looking around, I often get the impression that the people shopping there are considerably wealthier than I am.

I already know someone will want to tell me that being vegetarian can be cheap. I'm not interested in arguing about that. I'm just describing my own situation. I don't feel properly fed by eating salads, and meat is one of the cheapest and most practical sources of calories and protein available to me. Grains, meat and other basic foods make up the foundation of my diet.

Clothing is much the same. I simply cannot afford to buy clothes exclusively from ethical or sustainable brands. Sometimes H&M is what I can afford, and that's the end of the discussion.

And I don't say this to make some dramatic statement about how poor I am. My point is something else:

If you are poor, ethical consumption is often not realistically available to you.

And yet modern society constantly encourages us to feel guilty about our consumption.

Don't buy this. Don't eat that. Don't use plastic. Don't buy fast fashion. Buy organic. Buy sustainable. Buy ethically sourced. Check where everything was produced.

But why does so much of the responsibility fall on the consumer rather than the producer?

Am I really responsible for more plastic waste than Coca-Cola? Is my decision to buy a cheap T-shirt more important than the industrial system that produces millions of them? Why are individual consumers constantly asked to make morally perfect choices while companies are allowed to structure the entire market around making those choices difficult or unaffordable?

I don't think ethical consumption is inherently meaningless. I understand why people want to make better choices, and I don't think exploitation or environmental destruction should simply be accepted.

But I've started questioning the idea that the burden of solving these problems should primarily be placed on individual consumers.

Because if the ethical option is only affordable to people who already have enough money, then ethical consumption isn't really an individual moral choice available to everyone.

It's a privilege.

UPD: I feel guilty for giving up on it, but I don't really know what to do with the guilt that society puts on me. What am I supposed to do? Is unethical consumption morally justified for poor people, given the assumption that poor people simply cannot afford to consume ethically? And does what I wrote above imply that ethical consumption has become, above all, a new class signifier that allows us to divide society?

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[–] 60 points 3 weeks ago
[–] 58 points 3 weeks ago (30 children)

Quick note about vegetarianism if you still feel like trying:

You aren't supposed to fill yourself with salads. Try lentils, beans, potatoes, stir fried vegetables and tofu. There's a lot of Indian and Chinese and Asian recipes that are cheap, filling and tasty.

My personal favorite that I grew up eating was kidney beans and rice.

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  • [–] 45 points 3 weeks ago (1 child)

    Yeah being vegan is cheaper and I've never eaten a salad lol

    OP those meat replacements are aimed and priced for carnists, they're good once in a while but they aren't staples. Vegan proteins are things like beans & legumes, tofu, tempeh, textured vegetable protein (TVP), soya curls.

    Vegan meals are more filling because the biggest change most new vegans have to adjust to is the higher fiber. They're also lower calorie so you can intentionally add stuff you would avoid otherwise like more vegan butter or coconut milk to a chickpea curry. Chickpea spread and toast would be more filling than basically any fast food (I like chickpeas).

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  • [–] 23 points 3 weeks ago* (last edited 3 weeks ago) (27 children)

    i was about to say beans and rice are super inexpensive!!! and switching up my meals with different types of beans, veggie, and spice combos always keeps it fresh (but i'm a big chickpea fan cause it's fiber does wonders for my tummy). wanted to add that dried soya chunks are really cheap and supes high in protein too!!! its just most of the stuff that's trying to replicate animal products that runs expensive.

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  • [–] 17 points 3 weeks ago* (last edited 3 weeks ago)

    Yeah. Meat is way more energy intensive to make than vegetables. For most of history your main diet would be vegetables. Eating so much meat is a modern phenomenon and even then there are billions of poor people who eat little meat because of religion or cause they can't afford it.

    I always find it funny that people say vegetarianism is expensive. My parents are the first generation in my entire family line that could afford to buy meat. And they avoided it religiously. I'm probably the first person in at least 5 generations in my house to even taste meat (and only cause I was rebellious)

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  • [–] 50 points 3 weeks ago (2 children)

    I already know someone will want to tell me that being vegetarian can be cheap. I'm not interested in arguing about that. I'm just describing my own situation. I don't feel properly fed by eating salads, and meat is one of the cheapest and most practical sources of calories and protein available to me. Grains, meat and other basic foods make up the foundation of my diet.

    im sorry but this reads like a joke. vegans/vegetarians dont just eat salads.

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  • [–] 35 points 3 weeks ago

    There's a trick to ethical consumption.

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  • [–] 34 points 3 weeks ago

    "My consumption choices aren't going to single-handedly fix all the world's problems, therefore I'll pay people for the corpses of tortured innocents" is terrible logic

    You don't have to solve everything yourself. But you do have to be able to live with yourself at the end of the day, and I don't know how you could possibly look at the animal agriculture industry and decide that supporting it voluntarily is a choice you can live with. May as well donate to Israel while you're at it. Not donating isn't going to stop the genocide, right? So why not?

    I don't feel properly fed by eating salads

    I've been vegan for a decade and I think I've eaten two salads in that entire time.

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  • [–] 32 points 3 weeks ago

    There's like an inkling of truth in here about how (for example) recycling propaganda pushed on everyone in the late 90s/early 00s is comically individual when systemic change is needed, but I dunno. I'm literally so poor that I might get evicted month after next, and I still eat vegan. "Bio supermarket"? Comrade I shop at the same stupid grocery store I have for a decade. "Ethical or sustainable clothing brands"? I buy used clothes.

    Also BDS btw. If you do not give up on any other treats, at least this.

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  • [–] 32 points 3 weeks ago*

    I feel like your entire approach to ethical consumption is fueled in large parts by ads. Buying second hand clothing from literally whoever probably ends up way more sustainable than buying new patagonia or whoever advertises itself as such. Now sure this might also be hard where you are but it feels to me the approach is all wrong. Same for the veganism, as others pointed out.

    EDIT: I feel this might come across as mean-spirited, but I don't mean it so just to be sure

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  • [–] 28 points 3 weeks ago (5 children)

    What I think happened is that you listened to capitalist marketing about what decreasing consumption is, which of course means buying more from them, just different commodities. Of course they want you to go to the boutique zero waste shop that sells a steel tiffin container for like $30 and an overpriced grocery store with impeccable prewashed $8 lettuce or a trendy "vegan" restaurant that sells $15 burgers. Also I gotta doubt you looked into veganism that hard if you think it means you just eat salads.

    You don't actually have to think about it that much re: overall consumption. If you wanted to do it, you buy less often, buy used, avoid complex supply chains, avoid animal products. The Asian or latin market will feed you with grains, pulses, oil, and spices for like $50 for 2 months. You don't have to be that extreme but global poverty food is already somewhat optimized for lower impact. Tofu is like $2 per lb and has as much protein as steak, just gotta learn how to cook it. For clothes, how often do you need to buy them? Is a thrift store not getting you better for the same price or lower? Going to the thrift shop and buying dry beans is not a privileged position.

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    [–] 25 points 3 weeks ago (2 children)

    A lot of this reads very vibes based, like the eco labels and pivoting to fast fashion to try to save money?

    They've deskilled you and robbed you of your education and now they're milking you for profit. For instance, if you're struggling with cash it's more pragmatic to learn what nice looking clothes are durable and lasting, learn how to mend them, with a thread and needle. It does not take long and you don't need fancy machines. You can get yourself a whole wardrobe overtime and be super fancy with your variety of outfits. Warning that this comes with the burden of appearing wealthy.

    Nobody is asking you to be perfect, you'd do yourself a huge favor if you rid yourself of Neoliberalism and learn more Class based analysis. Yes they've sold you wrapped up exploitation, but you won't stop it by simply giving up either. If all you gain is more treats to consume eventually that will become the new normal and disappointment sets in.

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    [–] 21 points 3 weeks ago

    Have you ever made lentils?

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  • [–] 20 points 3 weeks ago* (last edited 3 weeks ago) (2 children)

    I personally like eating babies every day, they really melt in your mouth

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  • [–] 19 points 3 weeks ago

    In short, a strong belief that ethical consumption will lead to ethical practices is not warranted – purchasing as voting is a weak feedback mechanism at best and there are other actors who are able to influence the system. The danger, however, comes in believing that this mechanism can make substantial political change. Ethical consumption gives the individual the illusion of contributing to progress; of “doing their part” by making purchasing decisions. This illusion can detract, and probably has detracted, from trying to put forward an avowedly political agenda that seeks to mobilise people collectively to make the changes they support. Instead, it individualises ethics, it individualises politics and it reaffirms us as consumers rather than citizens – it is a part of the profit-maximising, pathologically-externalising neoliberal market system that has caused many of the problems ethical consumerism seeks to alleviate, rather than being an alternative.

    from The revolution will not be bought: Ethical consumption is seductive but dangerous to the values ethical consumers seek to promote

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  • [–] 16 points 3 weeks ago

    If one wishes to "ethically" consume that's fine for them but as you describe many people have an inflated sense of its importance. This is due to liberal ideology which places a high importance on our individual choices and their "moral" value, believing that those choices will somehow stack up or catch on in a mass way if one just sticks to them.

    Of course this ignores the societal scale forces that drive the choices "consumers" make in bulk.

    If I take my bike to work because it's more ethical than driving a car it takes me much more time and effort to get there, of course this will never result in everyone spontaneously taking the bike/bus. They already decided to drive. Am I making an "impact"? No! In fact I'm keeping a car off the road so I'm helping reduce traffic congestion and demand for gasoline which reduces the likelihood of someone else making the same choice. What might make an impact is getting together with like minded people and improving the bike infrastructure or bus service.

    Only with a change in (material) conditions will people change their choices. Individual consumer choices don't change the conditions, the outside forces that push us toward particular choices are the conditions.

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  • [–] 15 points 3 weeks ago* (4 children)

    lol. assuming you live in the western world, your taxes go directly towards killing kids in the middle east. coca cola plastic is not even the worst thing you contribute to by simply existing. take it easy.

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    [–] 10 points 3 weeks ago*

    Ethical consumption is like voting - Yeah, you are doing something by doing it, but alone it won't solve anything.

    Doing something else to actively change the system would be way better and more worth your time. If you can only do one, do the latter.

    As others have said, often the ethical choice is in learning how to consume less and still live an equally cool (if not even better) life. Learning 'real' vegetarian cooking is a good gateway to understanding that.

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  • [–] 9 points 3 weeks ago

    I mean that's kind the point of the phrase "there is no ethical consumption under capitalism". While it's not permission to consume everything without regard for ethics, it is a warning that you won't solve the systemic problems by trying to be an ethically perfect individual.
    On a personal level, choose a couple of boycotts you feel are likely to be effective and then live as best you can within your means. Maybe steal some stuff. Then stop worrying about your personal consumption and concentrate on organising so actual ethical consumption can be realised in the future.

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  • [–] 9 points 3 weeks ago* (last edited 3 weeks ago)

    While not trying to be perfect about this is reasonable imo and the points you make are all techically true I still try my best.

    I've been very poor by north european standards for a very long time (decades) and raised a kid with very little funds. Yes, we did buy h&m clothes, but we also used trift stores and on the whole consumed very little compared to the average middle class person. No treats, no travel, no flying. The clothes buying happens once a year.

    And when it comes to food I leaned heavier to vegetarian options due to poverty, because soy granules, beans and legumes are far cheaper than meat. I did a lot of adding 50% of a plant based protein to meat ti feed my kid and we ate well on a tiny budget. My black bean & beef patties are amazing, but I can also skip the meat. Then we went vegetarian for a few years and definitely could not afford the faux meat stuff, but I made stuff like lentil and soy lasagna and soy chunk sauces that are so much cheaper than meat and very good. You can do the whole "european" cuisine thing without meat for sure.

    It did make me feel better too. It isn't about being the perfect ethical consumer, but doing your best because you can. Resigning from that is giving away all kinds of agency even though your points about individual impact still hold true.

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