chapotraphouse

if you lived in a communist country, would you want to leave it to come live in this reactionary hellhole

When a lot of immigrants from Cuba, Vietnam, and China came over, the US was around 30-40% of the WORLD's GDP. These three countries' lifespans were literally a full decade lower than America's. The infrastructure and technology was easily many many decades behind

Not to mention a normal job in the US at the time could afford you a house and lifestyle that even the wealthiest of those countries would dream of

I mean yea there's a fuck load of South Vietnam immigrants but this argument is missing a lot of historical analysis

White supremacist's version of Mecca. The US is the only country on earth to carry out such a nearly complete and total genocide on an entire continent. The undisputed champions of fascism as we know it now.

The European colonial project that built the US killed literally hundreds of millions of people in the US alone, and that was before it was even the US.

And of those who survived, only ~8% are fluent in ANY of their native languages.

lmao my rich farmer great grandmother was kulak enough to have divided up their land between all the children and claimed they were all smallholders so nothing got redistributed

all their kids had joined the pla though, so it might have just been benefits for service

Yeah, as ever I recommend non-third-world people read Fanshen, about the fraught process of revolution in a town in China where the (long fled) Lord of the Manor owned a staggering 23 acres (for comparison, you probably can't support a family very well on less than three.), and the divide of rich and poor was if you could sometimes eat wheat and not millet.

Grouping communists (party associated with powerless laborers btw) with terrorists

You’ve gotta think that this low-effort propaganda is losing its steam but all the evidence points to the contrary

My conclusion is that just because you lived in a socialist country doesnt mean youre smart or understand socialism or geopolitics.

Just because you lived in a Communist revolutionary government, doesn't mean you ever got to experience the benefit of communal equality.

Remember, the vast majority of people in the countries that had revolutions were made up of the rural poor. When a revolution succeeds, it doesn't happen everywhere at once.

Reactionary forces and a host of their allies will carve toe holds and propagandize to the population under their control . It takes damn near a generation just for a revolutionary government to stabilize and that's if they aren't still fighting off fascist.

This is inherent to any revolution, not just socialism or communism. However, the problem is more pronounced with communism as the infrastructure requirements for command economics. This is typically even further exacerbated by the previous government, who usually try and punish the general public by destroying key infrastructure on the retreat, usually attempting to lay the blame on revolutionaries.

It's perfectly understandable why a person who fled any kind of revolution would hate the revolution. In their memory of the status quo things were bad, but they still had a home, a family, a community. We are beings made of memories of our past experiences, thus it is easier to to glorify what we know moreso than what we could know.

Revolution is hard. If it happens in a western nation people on both sides of the divide will loose homes, families, and communities. And if history has anything to tell us, there is a slim to zero percent chance that any of us would would ever live to see the transition of revolutionary government to post scarcity communism.

The fact that this is even question proves how disassociated the modern vanguard is from the proletariat in under developed countries. It basically amounts to victim blaming. "Why didn't you stay and fight for revolution, didn't you understand theory"? Well embodied theory is kinda hard to learn when you're starving, or constantly being shot at by people you don't know, for reasons you don't know.

People talk out of their ass all the time about everything. Living under a certain government does not make one an expert on that government any more than watching an MLB game makes one an expert on baseball. Tons of people who don't know shit about either will loudly share their opinions and throw a fit if you disagree.

Thr question isn't "have they seen it firsthand;" it's "do they understand the events around them and the associated context"?

An immigrant who is or has been a member of or affiliated with the Communist or any other totalitarian party is inadmissible under INA 212(a)(3)(D), unless an exception applies.

Under INA 212(a)(3)(D), an officer must first determine whether the organization in question meets the definition of Communist or any other totalitarian party.

The regulations define the Communist Party as:

-The Communist Party of the United States

-The Communist Political Association

-The Communist Party of any state of the United States, of any foreign state, or of any political or geographical subdivision of any foreign state;

-Any section, subsidiary, branch, affiliate, or subdivision of any such association or party;

-The direct predecessors or successors of any such association or party, regardless of what name such group or organization may have used, may now bear, or may hereafter adopt; and

-Any communist-action or communist-front organization that was required to register under former Section 786 of Title 50 of the U.S. Code, provided that the applicant knew or had reason to believe, while he or she was a member, that such organization was a communist-front organization.[30]

“Any other totalitarian party” is defined as “an organization which advocates the establishment in the United States of a totalitarian dictatorship or totalitarianism.”[31]

“Totalitarian dictatorship” or “totalitarianism” refer to systems of government not representative in fact, characterized by:

-The existence of a single political party, organized on a dictatorial basis, with so close an identity between such party and its policies and the governmental policies of the country in which it exists, that the party and the government constitute an indistinguishable unit; and

-The forcible suppression of opposition to such party.

After determining that the group in question meets the definition of the Communist or any other totalitarian party, the officer must determine if the person is or has been a member of or affiliated with that group. If the group does not meet the definition, then the person is not inadmissible under this ground.

https://www.uscis.gov/policy-manual/volume-8-part-f-chapter-3