Zensate comments on Religious cucks

[–] Zensate@lemmy.world 0 points 5 days ago (13 children)

Yes, in all likelihood you have some kind of neurodivergence. That's why you've probably noticed people around you rarely function through rational choice the way you do.

People are generally programmed to follow the tribe, keep opinions to confirm and demonstrate fealty to the tribe, and to avoid committing any taboos that could cause them to be cast out and die alone in the wild.

And the people who did not do this mostly just had this exact happen and died.

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[–] Objection@lemmy.ml 2 points 5 days ago (12 children)

I am neurodivergent, but I'm not prepared to accept the implication that neurotypical people lack moral agency. Anyone is capable of thinking critically about their behavior and changing it. Not every vegan is neurodivergent.

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[–] Zensate@lemmy.world -1 points 5 days ago (11 children)

You do not need to be neurodivergent to be vegan, but if you have arrived at veganism through rationality, you are neurodivergent.

Neurodivergents have very strong empathy, so it is nearly psychologically impossible to see neurotypicals for what the really are. The truth is simply too painful that even though confronted with it thousands of times, and hurt deeply by it, most neurodivergents prefer the delusion to reality.

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[–] Objection@lemmy.ml 1 point 5 days ago* (last edited 5 days ago) (10 children)

So you're really advancing this idea that all neurotypicals are essentially p-zombies? That every moral philosopher or moral person in history was secretly neurodivergent?

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[–] Zensate@lemmy.world -1 points 5 days ago (9 children)

What do you mean "advancing"? Every great person in history was clearly neurodivergent. They were clearly described as weird even for their time.

And of course every moral person was neurodivergent? Why do you think moral people are emphasized in our history? Why do you think people talking about morals are emphasized in our history? Do you think that's because morals are normal?

If someone was moral it was noteworthy, because it was abnormal. They were literally divergent.

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[–] Objection@lemmy.ml 1 point 5 days ago (8 children)

That's a ridiculous perspective. It's basically eugenics. Moral people do not just have some innate mental quality that causes them to be moral.

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[–] Zensate@lemmy.world -1 points 4 days ago (7 children)

They do, and it's been studied too. People with autism for example both score higher on a sense of justice and a willingness to go against peer-pressure to uphold it.

The famous Milgram experiment showed how neurotypicals were even willing to harm people as long as an authority told them to do so.

It's not a perspective, it's established science.

But you already knew this, right? If you are neurodivergent you can't have failed to observe this, regardless of your desire to live in a positive delusion. Reality is not so easily tuned out.

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[–] Objection@lemmy.ml 1 point 4 days ago (6 children)

No I don't "already know this" because it's not true. Trying to pass off your conspiracy theory as "established science" is utterly laughable.

People with autism for example both score higher on a sense of justice and a willingness to go against peer-pressure to uphold it.

That is only a trend. It doesn't mean that neurotypicals are incapable of caring about justice or acting upon it, or that neurodivergent people aren't subject to peer-pressure.

The famous Milgram experiment

The Miligram experiment? Are you seriously trying to cite that to show "established science?" That's utterly ridiculous. The Miligram was unethical, unscientific, and not replicable. It's junk data. You'll just latch onto anything that supports your bullshit thesis. Is there even evidence to show that all the participants in that experiment were neurotypical, or is that just something you assumed because it fits with what you want to believe? Not that it even matters since the "experiment" failed to meet very basic scientific standards.

But you already knew this, right?

But you already knew that the moon is made of cheese and that Bill Gates is secretly a lizard person right? Don't try to justify your conspiracy theory by acting like it's "common sense." What you're claiming is complete and total bullshit.

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[–] Zensate@lemmy.world -1 points 4 days ago* (5 children)

Discussions are meant to be in the service of uncovering the truth, but you went and got angry and now perceive this discussion as a fight for your sense of self.

This doesn't lead us anywhere, and regardless of who wins this perceived "fight" the truth will lose either way.

You take the time you need to settle back into clarity and then write a new reply, and we will doubtlessly get a fruitful conversation out of it.

And in the future don't be so willing to give away your emotional clarity, it is your most precious possession.

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[–] Objection@lemmy.ml 1 point 4 days ago (4 children)

Jesus Christ, could you be any more condescending? First it's, "But you already know I'm right, don't you?" and now it's, "You're so emotional and defensive, you can see anything clearly if you don't control your emotions."

Have you even considered the possibility that you could be wrong, and that my points are actually valid? The Miligram experiment is trash and it will always be trash regardless of my emotional state. Neurotypical people have moral agency and will continue to have moral agency regardless of my emotional state.

Yes, I'm frustrated with this discussion, but that's because you are not being rational.

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[–] Zensate@lemmy.world -1 points 4 days ago* (3 children)

Of course, at first it appears that our frustration comes from other people - but then some people get frustrated by one type of behaviour, while other people get frustrated by another type of behaviour - suddenly it becomes difficult to justify frustration as innately arising from certain behaviours, doesn't it? It all ends up being completely arbitrary and therefore without any central truth.

You get frustrated because the behaviours you perceive (which are rarely even the behaviours actually displayed) trigger uncomfortable emotions in you, which you are not aware you can simply turn your attention inwards and allow and sit with, so you believe you must fight the external cause for your frustration for your system to settle down - a paradigm that leaves you feeling completely dependant on other people's ability to adhere to whatever system of behaviours you believe to be the "proper one", for your emotions to stay in control.

Your points are actually irrelevant at this point, because the discussion is no longer about your points, your points are now being used as a weapon to win a fight in which you believe something is at stake. It's no longer just an interesting exchange of opinions.

So because you have exchanged clarity for frustration and blamed it on something external, the discussion is no longer about the discussion, so we'll have to discuss the thing that's in the way of the discussion first of all, so that you can recognize that your frustration is yours, give you the tools to sit with it and not need me to change for you to be calm, and only then can we return to yours and mine points in a friendly matter.

What a gift you've stumbled into really - a lifetime ahead of you where other people will never seem like the problem again, and you'll have the power to always take responsibility and regulate your own mental state.

A crossroads! But do you take a moment to turn inwards and discover your inherent power? Or do you explode outwards again.

These opportunities come once or twice in a person's lifetime. Wat will you do?

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