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geneva_convenience banned me from their comm (inventing_reality) after simply asking if they demand we hold all Jews accountable for Israel. (thelemmy.club)
submitted 3 days ago by to c/chapotraphouse@hexbear.net
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Jews are not systemically oppressed anymore but clearly certain reactionaries sure do want them to be.

Collective punishment is always wrong. You can't just make your whole ideology out of fuckinslammer memes or you turn into this person.

Parenti fucking rolling in his grave rn. You do not get to invoke a foundational modern marxist while doing the opposite of material analysis.

Would you apply the same logic to Christians? Arguably Christians have done far more harm. Or are you defining Jews as an ethnicity? How is that better? Is there something genetic or is it religious?

These may seem like silly semantic differences but they are actually important and the people that make either argument are wrong for the same reason: Collective punishment and collective guilt is always reactionary.

Ironically some of these same people would say I am doing Jewish exceptionalism but are they not doing the same thing claiming this is an exceptionally Jewish form of fascism.

I do not believe such distinctions are productive but rather only serve to excuse one's own participation in similar relations. By invoking some sort of Jewish exceptionalism you are only absolving yourself of guilt and complicity. By definition when you claim there is some sort of Jewish exceptionalism at play you are implying they are a special uniquely bad group apart from the international white supremacist project that enables and requires the existence of Israel.

You claim to be denouncing special treatment of Jewish persecution and overcorrect into actual Nazism. Or to be more accurate I guess Strasserism.

I no longer care if people want to call me a zionist for pointing this out. You are just embarassed white supremacists trying to offload your crimes onto Israel, there is nothing Israel has done that the rest of the west has not done tenfold, all are complicit and blaming it on Jews is just Nazi shit. I will fight to the death for the Palestinian people but I will not tolerate any single person implying collective guilt. This goes for everyone, white, black arab, persian, etc.

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[–] 9 points 2 days ago

I agree, the whole argument between the two of them only made me lose braincells. Of course a streamer like Hasan isn't going to aim for semantic correctness when he's pushing for an election win for a Muslim candidate. So dont put that much weight on what he says.

The thing is, you do eventually have no choice but to interface with the cultural side along with the material side. Religion and culture are powerful things, and just by taking a side in this conflict for the longest time it meant seeming anti-jew to most of the Jewish and Christian population. This sucked because you then had to answer for bigots and the some of the most bigoted opinions in history. So the recent effort to decouple Judaism from Zionism in the media has been useful for getting around this bs.

I think the bitterness coming from the geneva_convention and fuknslammer types comes from the electoral candidates piggybacking on this success. They are vindicated by the failure of campaigns like Platner and betrayals of AOC and so making the Palestinian cause less appealing to western leftists is seen to them as "helping".

They also may be too bitter now from viewing too many settlers videos and when you see that kind of violence perpetrated by mostly one religious group, the conclusion is you become bigoted towards that group. Combating that should be a main priority for Jewish activists. They should be involved in their synagogue and advocate for canceling Zionist activities like going on birthright. If they aren't currently the face of Jewishness, they should start becoming the face of Jewishness. It isn't all on us to forgive and forget.

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