Hacker News

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[+] BarneyPiccolo@lemmy.today -12 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago) (2 children)

I know all about it, but you still can't argue with Hundreds of Hijackings pre-9/11 vs Zero Hijackings post-9/11.

What people miss is that the TSA you see at the airports absolutely is Security Theater, and that's by design. It's meant to discourage the amateur terrorist while they are still in the planning stage. That maniac may go off and shoot up a school, or a movie theater, or a church, or some other softer target, but TSA was successful in keeping them from doing it on a plane.

Deterrence is a common goal in law enforcement. It's literally the entire objective of Speed Limit signs. It's not always about catching people red-handed in the midst of a crime. People commit less crime when they consider the known consequences, and deterrence is a primary objective of the elaborate airport security, no matter how accurate it is in catching threats.

As disappointing as all the reports are of TSA failures, they must be overstated, because nobody has been pulling guns, knives, or bombs on any planes since 9/11 (except the shoe and underwear bombers, who got their asses kicked by passengers).

And for the rare Professional Terrorist, that becomes a joint operation between Intelligence agencies, and TSA. If the system breaks down, and the guy gets on the plane with the weapon, then it is up to the passengers to take action, which they enthusiastically did in the cases of the shoe and underwear bombers.

So I know it's fashionable to bag on TSA, but if you look at the actual facts, and the actual results, it's a simple fact that the Airline Security System we have, which completely reversed the serious hijacking problem that America was having, has been successful.

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[–] daychilde@lemmy.world 8 points 5 months ago (1 child)

Wanna know the main reason hijackings stopped? United 93.

Before 9/11 when most hijackers were basically seeking transportation to somewhere for asylum (essentially), they generally wanted the plane to make it there and survive.

9/11 used the planes as weapons, and everyone learned that if you were hijacked, you needed to go all-out to take the plane back over so you didn't aall die.

There's your deterrance. Little to do with the TSA and everything to do with what changed on that day.

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[–] BarneyPiccolo@lemmy.today 1 point 5 months ago

Absolutely a major factor, and you can add to that the passenger response to attempts by the shoe bomber and the underwear bomber. But that's the last line of defense, and as 93 taught us it still went down, and killed everybody. Locked cockpits doors and passenger response may help against a hijacker who intends to survive the encounter, but these days, many of them are suicidal, and 93's fate is their exact objective.

And passenger response is easy to avoid anyway. The shoe and underwear bombers' only mistake was trying to do it on front of other passengers, who noticed. If they had just gone into the restroom, both of those planes would have crashed. They were saved as much by hijacker stupidity as passenger response.

Nothing that heavy should be flying through sky, they are basically up there by magic, so bringing down a plane is remarkably easy. A lithium laptop battery can supply a super hot fire that is almost inextinguishable. How many laptops are on board? One would be enough of a threat, but get them all burning, place them in strategic spots near emergency doors, wings, drop them in the cargo hold, etc. and that plane won't last long.

Bottom line: it's a good idea to keep hijackers off the plane in the first place, rather than leaving it to the passengers to save the day. Look around your workplace. Are THESE the people you think could save your life during a hijacking?