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Its not looking good.. (thelemmy.club)
submitted 7 months ago by to c/memes@lemmy.ml
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[–] 78 points 7 months ago (41 children)

Okay Russia is understandable cuz they're in a war, USA understandable cuz they're saber rattling, but genuinely what is China doing besides minding their own business?

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  • [+] -24 points 7 months ago (4 children)

    Buying ports and selling cars, generally speaking an economy war.

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  • [–] 58 points 7 months ago*

    economy war is when the west voluntarily hands you all its production and then gets mad that someone somehow handed the production over. i guess.

    edit: the people actually waging economic war on you are your own god damned ruling class.

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  • [–] 33 points 7 months ago (1 child)

    then dont sell the ports and buy the cars?

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  • [–] 20 points 7 months ago

    No no no, you don't understand, we wanted to make money from the ports and produce the cars but they had to be the complex, oil-sucking ones because those are hard to produce and we and our partners made good profits from the oligopoly and making cheap and environment friendly cars is just cheating. It's against the rules-based world order! Also, Uyghurs!

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  • [+] -34 points 7 months ago (24 children)

    China is the evil economy.
    Boost their own, flood foreign.

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  • [–] 43 points 7 months ago (11 children)

    What do you mean "evil economy?" Is producing goods a bad thing?

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  • [+] -29 points 7 months ago (8 children)

    Flooding foreign economies with cheap subventioned goods so the domestic can't compete and go out of business and thus increasing dependency in you.
    Yes, I'd say this is bad.

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  • [–] 40 points 7 months ago

    This is just cope, though. China has better industrial capacity, and can produce high quality goods for lower prices because of this. It isn't because of evil, it's because China as a socialist economy is surpassing capitalist economies.

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  • [–] 37 points 7 months ago (4 children)

    Bad for who

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  • [–] 34 points 7 months ago* (3 children)

    It is a pretty bad deal for Western workers that our economies have deindustrialized. But that's not China's fault, that's our ruling classes' fault.

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  • [–] 5 points 7 months ago (2 children)

    Deindustrialization itself isn't really bad. It's a neutral thing.

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  • [–] 13 points 7 months ago

    I would argue that it is in fact bad because it's a threat to national security and sovereignty. The Europeans are now finding out that they're unable to produce things domestically that their people need, and have become entirely reliant on US energy exports and military protection.

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  • [–] 31 points 7 months ago

    The goods produced in China are cheap because Western economies made a bet that they'd come out ahead by moving their capital out of their own economies and into China. China won the bet instead of them and now has more productive capacity than the West. Why is it China's fault that the West had poor foresight and deindustrialized itself in exchange for short term profits? Should Chinese workers have remained poor forever instead of benefiting from Western investments?

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  • [–] 21 points 7 months ago

    China isn't forcing anybody to buy their goods at gunpoint last I checked. The fact that western markets are unable to produce comparable goods at the same prices is entirely the problem with the way western economies are structured. The whole premise for loosely regulated markets was that they were supposed to be more efficient than state planning, turns out that was a big fat lie. So now the dumb fucks in the west are crying that their failed economic model can't compete with China. Tough!

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  • [–] 37 points 7 months ago (10 children)

    What are you talking about. What country doesn't want to boost their economy???

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  • [+] -26 points 7 months ago (9 children)

    Between an exchange of goods and services and flooding it by subventiontioning to suppress the competition is teensy tiny difference, no?

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  • [–] 39 points 7 months ago (8 children)

    This is called a "skill issue" on the hand of western imperialists that can't compete. Stop framing doing better as being evil.

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  • [+] -26 points 7 months ago (5 children)

    Evil is in the eye of the beholder.

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  • [–] 28 points 7 months ago

    Evil is the invisible hand of the market fisting the ass of your country, who send their production to a foreign country, and then start crying because they get better after decades of doing what guys should have being doing all along.

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  • [–] 23 points 7 months ago

    Explain how it's evil to allow the US companies to move their production out of the US? The US corporations could have kept industry here, but they decided to fuck themselves over so that a few shareholders' margins went up by a few percentage points. That wasn't China being malicious, that's the US lacking any sense of foresight while being blinded by greed.

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  • [+] -34 points 7 months ago (9 children)

    They are literally genociding part of their population to enforce a unique race

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  • [–] 36 points 7 months ago

    They aren't? Not only is the idea of mass Uyghur slave labor atrocity propaganda akin to claiming that there's "white genocide" in South Africa, Christian genocide in Nigeria, or that Hamas sexually assaulted babies in Operation Al-Aqsa Flood, but the PRC is an incredibly industrialized country and as such doesn't have a need for slavery. Slavery in general is a horribly inefficient system fir anything other than agrarian production, which is why the Statesian North liberated the slaves in the south, for more wage-laboring industrial workers.

    In the case of Xinjiang, the area is crucial in the Belt and Road Initiative, so the west backed sepratist groups in order to destabilize the region. China responded with vocational programs and de-radicalization efforts, which the west then twisted into claims of "genocide." Nevermind that the west responds to seperatism with mass violence, and thus re-education programs focused on rehabilitation are far more humane, the tool was used both for outright violence by the west into a useful narrative to feed its own citizens.

    The best and most comprehensive resource I have seen so far is Qiao Collective's Xinjiang: A Resource and Report Compilation. Qiao Collective is explicitly pro-PRC, but this is an extremely comprehensive write-up of the entire background of the events, the timeline of reports, and real and fake claims.

    I also recommend reading the UN report and China's response to it. These are the most relevant accusations and responses without delving into straight up fantasy like Adrian Zenz, professional propagandist for the Victims of Communism Foundation, does.

    Tourists do go to Xinjiang all the time as well. You can watch videos like this one on YouTube, though it obviously isn't going to be a comprehensive view of a complex situation like this.

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  • [–] 32 points 7 months ago (4 children)

    Can you provide a source for that claim?

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  • [+] -6 points 7 months ago (2 children)

    "Since 2014, the government of the People's Republic of China has committed a series of ongoing human rights abuses against Uyghurs and other Turkic Muslim minorities in Xinjiang which has often been characterized as persecution or as genocide. There have been reports of mass arbitrary arrests and detention, torture, mass surveillance, cultural and religious persecution, family separation, forced labor, sexual violence, and violations of reproductive rights."

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persecution_of_Uyghurs_in_China

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  • [–] 15 points 7 months ago

    Their source for the genocide claim is this article that immediately cites Adrian Zenz. Do you have a source that can corroborate the genocide claim that doesn't rely on Adrian Zenz? I don't think he's a good faith scholar.

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