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[–] 27 points 1 year ago (15 children)

Fellas, is it gay to be into women who are also mammals?

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  • [+] 21 points 1 year ago* (last edited 6 months ago) (14 children)
  • [–] 8 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    Well said!

    And I will emphasize that this point:

    just live for gaining wealth and respect

    is part of the problem with the whole conservative strong male image before you even get to the relationship status. I was raised to think that way, not being explicitly told that but it being an ingrained part of the culture.

    And even THAT is a subset of the value placed on conformity and pursuing the goals you are supposed to pursue rather than what brings you actual fulfillment.

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  • [–] -5 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (11 children)

    I cannot fathom how more and more men are latching onto this shit even as statistically, they are more lonely than ever before.

    Because toxic masculinity communities are one of the few online spaces which don’t stigmatize you for being a white male and daring to have problems in your life despite your “privilege”.

    If people stopped talking down on young males and actually listened to their problems, all these toxic masculinity gurus wouldn’t get the tiniest fraction of the following they have. But as long as we keep pushing onto them all the sins of everyone who ever lived with their same gender, they’ll end up falling in those communities which turns them into Andrew Tate replicas.

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  • [–] 9 points 1 year ago (3 children)

    The problem with this is, and it drives me crazy, I keep hearing "if we talked to them-"

    I'm a woman! They won't talk to me! Or, if they do, it's to tell me why I'm wrong, because I'm a woman! This isn't something I can deprogram away!

    And trust me, I've deprogrammed right-wing shitheads before, who weren't also misogynists. I can't do shit for the ones who aren't willing to talk to me. And the worst part? I have gotten lots of seemingly hopeless people into committed, loving, long-term relationships through the power of just listen to me, I can help you, but nooooo! I have breasts! I'm almost 40! I have a happy, long-term relationship, and I'm a woman, so what can I possibly know!

    I'm sick to death of 'we just need to-' No we don't, because we can't. Men need to. Men need to break through this toxic bullshit because we, and by this I mean, women, literally can't. And trying- and trust me on this because I've tried- trying only gets abuse.

    I really can't underscore this enough. The wall I come up against is, what do you know, you're a woman. "We" can't talk our way out of this one. The problem of toxic masculinity intentionally boxes women out, making it nigh impossible for women to help.

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  • [–] 5 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    I know. The main thing they need is a non-misogynist male role model, which is becoming increasingly hard to find because apparently social media algorithms encourage the type of content that pushes them in the opposite direction.

    Realistically, imo, the main way women can help with this, besides talking to them very early on (VERY early on, as Tate-types are unfortunately gaining traction in school as well), is trying to combat the misandrist narrative that keeps on growing in feminist spaces. One example is the whole Bear debacle, which furthered the divide between genders even more. If people (in general, I’m sure many men shared it as well) keep making stuff like that go viral, it makes it harder and harder for young males to develop any sort of empathy for the opposite sex.

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  • [–] 4 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    I find it very difficult to empathize with the 'bear thing,' because, as my fiance (who is a man) put it, 'I don't know why anyone would pick any other human over the bear. Bears tend to avoid you and do your own thing. Humans are unpredictable.'

    From that perspective, it seemed like a lot of people just got mad because they identify with the word 'man,' here, and don't want to think of themselves as capable of evil. Which would be naive, because everyone is capable of anything.

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  • [–] -1 points 1 year ago

    Bears don’t “tend to avoid” any more than people do. There’s dangerous people that would assault you, and there’s species of bears (i.e. Polar Bears) that would definitely attack you on sight.

    But the whole thing is not about the technicality. The videos were very clearly framed with emphasis on the gender of the human, they got extremely viral and millions of young males saw women saying stuff like “at least the bear would kill me instantly”. How do you think they felt, as kids that probably never even had a relationship before? You think that “helped them understand the women’s point of view” like they said was the purpose of the video, or brought them in the opposite direction, making them feel like they’re some different species, impossible to relate with, planting a seed that will only grow through the indoctrination of all the online toxic masculinity gurus?

    Enough with the “Men vs. Women”, especially online where young kids will see them without any context of why is that happening. Both sexes need to do their best to stop prejudices towards the other inside their groups, and only then we can have a serious and understanding conversation. Of course that’s hard to do between algorithms and bad actors, but there’s really nothing else we can do at this point, since the large majority of both camps is entrenched in their opinion and will only listen to people of their own gender.

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago

    Except that nobody stigmatises people for being a white male and having problems.

    Everyone has problems; the fact is though, that this rhetoric you just used, is part of a tactic to sow division. When the real problem is the oligarchs, that want to distract from them causing those problems.

    The 'loneliness pandemic'? Caused by dating companies trying to profit on relationships. The more often you get a date but that just about fails, the better.

    Your feed showing ragebait? Again, it feeds the algorithm and interaction with that social network, giving the owner more profit.

    Toxic masculinity communities absolutely stigmatise; try for example showing empathy, hugging friends, and so on... and toxic masculinity communities by definition, are extremely hateful towards any sort of compassion. They trap you in a cycle fed by rich people so that you focus hatred on minorities, which ultimately share the same problems just as you.

    Everyone is poorer, everyone has issues to work through, everyone needs a good home and life, affordable and healthy food; and the prime cause for all that being impossible, is oligarchs trying to divide us; because they know we have strength in numbers.

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  • [+] 1 point 1 year ago* (last edited 6 months ago) (5 children)
  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago (4 children)

    Where i’m baffled though is the basic math. Younger people are having less and less sex and relationships, people are broadly staying single and not dating or having any intimacy well into adulthood and often have NO plans to date or have a family even, so how is this eruption of sweaty used-car-salesmen making traction? There are no success stories, it’s entirely manufactured. It’s no different than the flat-earth movement but for pudgy white teenage boys.

    The “success story” is Andrew Tate, and probably even people like Musk or Trump. They see how extremely misogynistic people manage to get with multiple women nonetheless and get fooled into thinking being “stoic” and generally a jerk is the key to getting laid. They don’t realize that those people are just rich and are getting laid despite their personality, not thanks to it.

    Then there’s also the ones who are fully aware of this and are sold on the “grind mentality”, so that they can get rich like them (again, missing the point on how all of them either did it through crimes, were born rich, or both).

    Of course if you look at it with some logic it all falls apart, but you can’t expect young people to have enough knowledge to do this. They need some positive role model to tell them right from wrong, but it’s becoming increasingly hard when the negative ones keep springing up like mushrooms.

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  • [+] 2 points 1 year ago* (last edited 6 months ago) (2 children)
  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago* (1 child)

    Yup, all of this is true and it’s sad how people with influence fail to understand this.

    You talked about 17-22 yo, which definitely feel negatively about people lecturing them on what they feel is an irresistible primal instinct, but another big issue is that, in the digital era, even younger kids are exposed to that. Older teenagers may feel like something they did is seen as terribly wrong and be angry at that, but there’s younger ones that probably can only think “…what did I even do? Why is everyone angry at me just because I’m a boy?”.

    And guess who comes in to give them “answers” when they’re in that confused and vulnerable state? Yup, Tate & friends. Really, they’ve figured everything about how to make as many people as possible fall in their rabbithole to profit from them, and we’re doing nothing to stop them. Even Tate was arrested only because he did some heinous shit to people “working” with him AND boasted about that, otherwise he’d still be around. We need some serious regulations on social media algorithms, but I doubt we’re ever gonna see those in our lifetimes considering who’s in power.

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago*

    But that's the thing. Tate isn't a success story.

    How is someone who beats wives and rapes children alike a success story? Applies to both.

    How is someone a success story, when they get into crippling debt and can't even get their dick up, yet claim to be the perfect image of a virile guy?

    For me, as one of those "success stories", true success lies in empathy and respect. Hard work must be used to give back to society, and whoever gives not back, must be respectfully shunned and made to give back, until they reach out and ask for help; and then answer is given in the form of unionising, protesting against oligarchies trying to break down mental health facilities, protesting against hatred that must fail to divide us.

    Types that may seem beyond saving, I think can be saved; if they radicalised once, they can deradicalise once again. But it does require effort.

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