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Chinese EV maker BYD says new fast-charging system could be as quick as filling up a tank (www.theguardian.com)
submitted 2 years ago by to c/technology@lemmy.world
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[–] 13 points 2 years ago (8 children)

I always think about an “imaginary” scenario where we all have ultra fast charging like this and plug our cars in at the same time. Would the grid experience a brownout?

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  • [–] 14 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (3 children)

    I studied this a bit in my MS and the answer is... probably not. "The grid will collapse" has been an anti-technology or pro fossil fuel talking point for a very long time, whether* its arguing against renewables or against personal computers or against AC units. The most recent was solar. Grid operators were adamant that solar would crash the grid if it accounted for more than 10%, then 20%, then 30% and so on and it never happened. Now it's onto EVs being the grid destroyer.

    The reality is that production and use is not all that hard to predict. Ultrafast charging will eat some power, but that isn't going to be the norm for wide EV adoption. Public charging will cost more money and be less convenient than charging at home or work over a longer duration. Home chargers are capping around 30-35 amps, generally overnight when grid demand is low. Couple this with the combined low cost for residential solar to change at even lower rates depending on your state/nation's hostility to solar.

    Now, if every car was replaced with an EV tomorrow, the grid would struggle. But that's not going to happen. Adoption will be a long slow process and energy producers will increase output on pace as demand forecasts increase. A good parallel to this is Air Conditioning adoption. That's another high demand appliance that went from rare to common. The grid has its challenges, but now the AC usage is forcastable and rarely challenges the grid.

    Is it a challenge, especially with higher renewable mixtures, yes. Can utilities fumble? Of course. Will it be a widespread brownout every day during commute hours? Not likely.

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  • [+] -7 points 2 years ago*

    If you truly have an "MS" then it should be trivial for you to do the math and calculate the power requirements of even a dozen cars being charged at the rate of 1 Megawatt each.

    A bare 12 chargers, the equivalent of a single small gas station, would certainly collapse the grid its attached to. These kinds of charging rates aren't possible outside the parking lot of a power plant.

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  • [–] 7 points 2 years ago (2 children)

    Things like that can definitely be accomodated. A famous example is how the UK would keep pumped storage hydro power ready for moments like half time in major football games or breaks in popular TV shows, because the entire country would pretty much simultaneously put their kettles on

    Charging a car is a much bigger draw than powering a kettle, obviously, but the point is that these things tend to be reasonably predictable and we are able to ccount for them if we know they are coming

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  • [–] 6 points 2 years ago

    Combined cycle natural gas plant operator in the US here. Bridging the gap between low demand and high demand times is a big part of why it's so challenging to try to reduce fossil fuel power solutions. The grid is basically a pressurized pipeline, and it's only reliable if that pressure is maintained no matter how many "faucets" get opened or closed. Green energy solutions aren't really able to raise that "pressure" unless we build significantly more than we need and keep a bunch of them off most of the time until peak conditions demand them. Nuclear is extremely slow (relatively speaking) to (safely) alter output to meet demand, so its best usecase is for baseloading as much as possible. But with a natural gas plant, I can put my foot on the gas pedal, figuratively speaking. It's fucking terrible for the environment, but that's the cost of everybody insisting on consuming so much goddamn electricity all the time. If you don't like it, stop supporting power hogs like data centers by using AI bullshit and cloud storage and web hosting and media streaming.

    This is a complicated problem, and complicated problems almost never have simple solutions. I wish we could minimize the problem of what happens when 100M+ EVs get plugged in at 7pm on a Tuesday by already having put together a strong public transportation infrastructure that people feel comfortable and safe using, but the time to start doing that was probably during the gas shortage in the 70s when we saw how overly reliant we were on cars. It's probably not too late to start, but it's gonna be a challenging transition now no matter what we do.

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