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On Sept. 10, Prime Minister Mark Carney and Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy announced a series of initiatives to expand Canada’s defence capabilities and support Ukraine.

Industry participants say Ukraine, now in its fifth year of war with Russia, has considerable battlefield experience Canada can learn from.

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Six Canadian defence suppliers [aare] receiving federal contracts worth up to $50 million in total to produce drones and uncrewed ground vehicles.

Last week, Carney also announced a partnership between Ottawa-based General Dynamics Mission Systems-Canada and Ukrainian company Green Tech Harvest to produce drones and related technologies.

That partnership is the latest in a series of Canada-Ukraine drone arrangements. In May, Hamilton-based Sentinel Research and Development also announced a drone production agreement with Ukrainian defence company Airlogix.

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The goal is ambitious: to give Canadian industry the capacity to produce “millions of drones over the next two years,” according to the Prime Minister’s Office.

Ottawa says the initial contracts will “increase the number of drones currently deployed by the Canadian Armed Forces tenfold.”

Much of this production will go to Ukraine.

“Thirty per cent of these drones will go to Ukraine immediately to [the] battlefield,” Zelenskyy said during the joint press conference with Carney.

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Sergii Vlashchenko and Igor Kolosiuk, Ukrainian defence-technology experts and co-founders of Vancouver-based Snake Island Lab, say such qualities have enabled Ukraine to hold its own against a larger and wealthier Russia.

“Every large brigade, every army corps … has its own research and development laboratory, manufacturing capabilities, and financing capabilities inside the corps,” Vlashchenko said in a joint interview with Kolosiuk.

“It lets them face a challenge, invent to overcome it, and manufacture the response within weeks.”

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A June study found that Ukrainian producers could move from prototype to deployment in weeks, with some minor fixes implemented within 24 hours.

The cost benefits of this approach are considerable.

Ukraine spends as little as US$200 to $1,000 on a typical FPV drone. Before Ukraine popularized these drones, the U.S. military could have previously spent as much as US$53,000 for the closest equivalent.

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Kolosiuk says Ukraine is looking to Canada for a more secure supply chain. He says the two countries could build a scalable, non-Chinese supply chain serving both the Canadian and Ukrainian militaries.

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[+] -6 points 1 day ago (28 children)

This tech could be used to reforest, clean pollution, and do any number of marvels, instead it will be used to kill civilians in the global South and probably the East.

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  • [–] [S] 9 points 1 day ago (17 children)

    This tech could be used to reforest, clean pollution, and do any number of marvels, instead it will be used to kill civilians in the global South and probably the East.

    This tech is to be used for defense, in case hostile governments attack a country such as Russia does in Ukraine and China has been threatening against Taiwan ...

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  • [–] -2 points 1 day ago (12 children)

    If you think Canada can defend Taiwan from China with tech ultimately supplied from China, I have multiple bridges and an Empire State building to sell you.

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  • [–] 9 points 1 day ago (9 children)

    You are missing the forest for the trees. The US is our single biggest threat and its not outside the realm of possible that Trump will threaten strikes on Canada. These drones are our best deterrent to the US. Just like Ukraine proved against Russia and Iran proved against the US. Its not about projecting overseas. Its about deterring the US.

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  • [+] -7 points 1 day ago (8 children)

    I can't decide if this group is full of provocateurs, or if this is just fantasy football with weapons.

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  • [–] 7 points 1 day ago (7 children)

    You're saying nothing and trying to sound smart. Respond to the issue at hand instead of making ad hominem attacks.

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  • [–] -2 points 1 day ago (6 children)

    It's not an attack, it's an observation. A lot of these statements lack realism.

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  • [–] 3 points 1 day ago* (4 children)

    So you think it is not in the realm of possible that the US could threaten to strike canada? Honest question since you are claiming to talk observations and realism. Keep in mind the US is already engaging in economic warfare against canada, openly wanting to annex canada, and already engaging in illegal bombing of several all of its neighbours.

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  • [–] -2 points 1 day ago (3 children)

    The only people talking about wanting to annex Canada are MAGA, that's only a fraction of the U.S voter base.

    Actively talking about using lethal drones against Americans as a result of a stupid trade war is exactly what the Heritage foundation/Federalist society/U.S oligarchs want you to be doing.

    Any time that Canada has ever taken part in an economic sanction, could have easily been construed as "economic warfare."

    Imagine the list of nations who would have violently retaliated against Canada if that was a reasonable course of action.

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  • [–] 4 points 1 day ago

    You kinda said it yourself, it's the US oligarchy that wants minerals, gas, land for DCs, labour, etc. It's well researched that most voters in the US don't have a significant effect on oligarch-serving state policy. It follows that even if MAGA loses power, the oligarch class won't stop getting the state to do its bidding vis-a-vis Canadian resources. If the US system moves in a democratic socialist direction with the Berniecrats taking power and drastically reducing the oligarchy's power, then I'd expect change. Change in that the will of the majority of Americans who don't want to exploit us would be reflected in state policy. This is not an endorsement of the current mil spending plans. I do think some mil spending would be required tho to create deterrents. Especially for the times when climate-driven droughts in the US intensify. Deterrents should help sharing our resources peacefully, rather than through force.

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  • [–] 3 points 1 day ago

    See, now you're presenting your position instead of just calling everyone else delusional, etc.

    Actively talking about using lethal drones against Americans as a result of a stupid trade war

    Who said that? We have, and will continue to respond to a trade war with like-for-like measures.

    Developing and manufacturing drones is for defending ourselves in case of a physical attack. I don't know what makes you think anyone is suggesting Canada would be stupid enough to attack the US physically because of a trade war.

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  • [–] [S] 2 points 1 day ago* (1 child)

    Kolosiuk says Ukraine is looking to Canada for a more secure supply chain. He says the two countries could build a scalable, non-Chinese supply chain serving both the Canadian and Ukrainian militaries.

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  • [–] -2 points 1 day ago

    With what tech factories? We're talking about "millions" of complex machines created with precious metals sourced from all over the world, built outside the purview of the 3 of the worlds biggest superpowers. Superpowers that control mining, shipping, espionage and technology.

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  • [+] -1 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (9 children)
  • [–] 1 point 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (7 children)

    The RCMP and settler groups were totally capable of doing horrible things to Indigenous people and curtailing people's rights without needing to use drones. We have to catch, stop and outlaw the oppression, not the tech.

    Ukrainian drone tech provides us with far more capability in an asymmetric defensive war scenario than the additional utility it might give oppressors, and I don't think any would-be oppressors are only holding back because of lack of domestic drone production, you can show me otherwise.

    Said production lines can be dual-purpose, to make domestic consumer and commercial drones for tree planting, fire spotting and firefighting. This would be helpful for self-managed Indigenous Nations and bands too. Once it's up and running, production facilities can quickly do a large scale switchover to military types in the unlikely event we are invaded.

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  • [–] 0 points 1 day ago* (6 children)

    In what way does this read as a condemnation of the tech itself and not what it is obviously used for, which is settler-colonialism and extractive capitalism?

    Also, "asymmetric" is an interesting term to use here, as it suggest the primary concern is Canada and its competition with more powerful imperialists, not oppressed peoples. There are examples of oppressed peoples using drones for as long as they existed -- it was a popular cheap tactic in Iraq in the late 00s and early 10s -- but that is not mass production scale infrastructure, that is a group of people purchasing and using these against imperialists like Canada (also, "were," "would-be," think you're slick with that obscuring language?). I don't give a fuck about Canada defending its ability to colonize, that is the exact shit I warned against in my comment.

    Also, I'm sorry, but that is such a fucking lie to suggest that these would be used for tree planting when the federal government has expressed great interest in doing the exact opposite of that (https://natural-resources.canada.ca/forests-forestry/forest-industry-trade/canadian-forest-sector-transformation-task-force; https://thenarwhal.ca/carney-canada-net-zero-committee/; and it's important to remember that Carney is one of the fucks responsible for formulating environmental marketing for privatized industry as a Brookfield ESG lead shill and a founder of the Taskforce of Scaling Voluntary Carbon Markets). Are there any good examples of that happening with any other military manufacturing system here in Canada?

    I can see how this response would look legitimate to the average rube on this community, but those were some very selective arguments that employ the exact narratives that imperialists and neoliberals have for decades, wonder why you'd use something so specific.

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  • [–] 2 points 1 day ago* (5 children)

    People ITT are cheering the tech which is what the article is about, and you're the one who is making it about settler-colonialism and capitalist extraction, and complaining about people's reactions you are ascribing to as a support for something they never claimed to. So, I'm addressing your whataboutism in good faith while sticking to the topic.

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  • [+] 0 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (4 children)
  • [–] 1 point 1 day ago* (3 children)

    I'm fully aware of what kind of dystopia it can bring about, I've read too much about Israel's use of it against Palestinians and it's horrifying. But just because they use it that way, doesn't mean we have to use or will be using it in the same way.

    My principal point is that drone-based oppression is available with non-Canadian components already and through other means you've rightly identified like paramilitary goons, and plenty of examples over several centuries. Building a domestic supply chain for drones or not doesn't make a big difference for horrible people to do horrible things, as much as it will make a big difference for us to defend ourselves if needed, and be useful in other ways when we don't need to. *And to stop the export of the tech for oppressive uses is a legislative/political fix.

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  • [+] 1 point 1 day ago* (2 children)