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LG smart TVs caught logging audio with screen off and snooping on local devices (www.notebookcheck.net)
submitted 3 weeks ago by to c/technology@lemmy.world
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An investigation by Gamers Nexus found LG smart TVs sweep local networks to map phones and nearby devices. Tests also showed the sets can capture microphone audio with the screen off — they then upload data once reconnected to the internet.

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[–] 32 points 3 weeks ago (36 children)

This is why my tv’s don’t get internet access.

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  • [–] 29 points 3 weeks ago

    My TVs don't get connected to the network because TV companies have started showing ads, and that was bad enough. Then came the fact that a lot of TV apps were making your TV into a residential proxy, making your TV into part of a botnet. And now, on top of all that, they're spying on you.

    The ads were bad enough.

    In any reasonable world you would have control over devices in your house that contained computers and would be able to remove bad software and install your own stuff. But, these devices are all covered by section 1201 of the DMCA which makes it a crime to bypass any access control software. This is how Apple is able to block alternate app stores. It's why printer ink is the most expensive liquid on the planet. It's why John Deere is able to remotely brick a tractor anywhere in the world, and prevent farmers from fixing their own farm equipment.

    What's especially galling about this is that, the US forced the rest of the world to adopt this bullshit as a part of trade treaties, threatening that any country that didn't do it might lose tariff-free access to the US economy. And now what happened? Trump just ripped up those treaties anyhow and imposed the tariffs anyhow.

    I just wish there was a country brave enough to rip up the IP agreements the US forced on them and allow us to actually own our own stuff again.

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  • [–] 14 points 3 weeks ago (7 children)

    They speculated it could connect anyway via some router brands, that allow specific devices to connect automatically. Since cases like that happened.

    So if it's range of neighbours' routers, you might be fucked anyway. They didn't confirm it though, to be clear.

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  • [–] 0 points 3 weeks ago (3 children)

    Then you can watch all the depraved porn you want to, and the Government will think it's coming from the house with the insecure wifi

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  • [–] 2 points 3 weeks ago (2 children)

    No, it sends mac addresses. It knows exactly which tv and where, doesn't care that it connected via your neighbor or some public wifi.

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  • [–] 1 point 3 weeks ago* (1 child)

    not necessarily, MAC is a layer 2 protocol, and your router (NAT or no NAT) operates on layer 3. Routers are supposed to overwrite the MAC address with their own when they forward a packet.

    It's always possible for the unit to put its own identfying info in the payload. But you didn't do anything silly like register the TV, did you?

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  • [–] 7 points 3 weeks ago (21 children)

    This is why I don't buy smart TVs in the first place.

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  • [–] 12 points 3 weeks ago (6 children)

    Unless you're buying a commercial screen of some kind, you can't really buy dumb TVs anymore, at least not from the major brands.

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  • [–] 1 point 3 weeks ago (5 children)

    You can still buy dumb TVs you just have to search for them. You can also go off brand and get a dumb TV from a brand like sceptre.

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  • [–] 3 points 3 weeks ago (4 children)

    I searched and couldn't find a modern OLED from a reputable brand that didn't have "smart" features.

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  • [–] 1 point 2 weeks ago (2 children)

    The only thing close I can think of are TVs made for hospital or retail screens.

    They have all the garbage removed I understand.

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  • [–] 2 points 2 weeks ago (1 child)

    They're also typically low quality screens and much more expensive.

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  • [–] 1 point 2 weeks ago

    Okay, the couple I’ve seen are pricier but seem to be the same screens, just without the bullshit that these companies make data or service provision money off.

    I won’t argue with it though, I’d have to look further.

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  • [–] 1 point 2 weeks ago

    I just went to the Sceptre website, they have non-smart TVs listed. You just have to look at the listings. I'm sure there are other brands, I've just had good luck with Sceptre so I stopped looking.

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  • [–] 3 points 3 weeks ago (3 children)

    I just don't have a TV.

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  • [–] 1 point 3 weeks ago (2 children)

    I mean that works too, I'm just not a fan of watching things on computer monitors. Sometimes I just want to sit in a recliner and watch a movie on a larger screen.

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  • [–] 3 points 3 weeks ago (1 child)

    Yeah that's fair. Personally, I live in a really small space so steam deck and phone are my only devices. Don't think I'd feel comfortable with a TV that reported back on me - but TBF I do have a phone which I'm sure is doing that anyway!

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  • [–] 2 points 2 weeks ago

    I'm lucky enough to have the room for a TV and chair so I take advantage of it. Though I do mostly spend my time at the computer, so I have a small TV next tot he computer and just stream ad supported shows that I only half pay attention to. We all do what works for us.

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  • [–] 1 point 3 weeks ago (9 children)

    Is this even possible or reasonable? Smart tvs are pretty dumb if you never connect them to the internet, so no issues until they decide to add 5g chips to them

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  • [–] 5 points 3 weeks ago (5 children)

    Or... If your neighbor has an open network... Or the TV has a secret networking protocol that allows it to talk to other LG smart devices that are on a network. Or it looks for phones that have the LG app installed.. You get the idea. Once you put wireless capabilities in it, there is any number of ways it can leak your data out.

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  • [–] 2 points 3 weeks ago (1 child)

    My solution here (this is my solution; i recognize 99.5% of people would never do this) is to open up the tv and physically remove any wifi adapters or cards. Obviously not stopping them from hiding them, but being under the plastic shell is enough to stop most people

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  • [–] 1 point 2 weeks ago

    I was wondering about this type of fix. Just physically disconnecting, desoldering, or even destroying the wifi hardware and microphone(s). I'm sure they have the usual passive anti-tampering stuff, but I'm guessing it won't brick the TV if you're careful and know what you're doing. Not that I know what I'm doing. But I'm capable of following a YouTube video showing me how to.

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  • [–] 2 points 3 weeks ago (2 children)

    Sure prove it. At least these are proven and now your just making stuff up.

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  • [–] 3 points 3 weeks ago (1 child)

    Proving it is the hard and expensive part. I don't really have the time, skillset, or money to buy a bunch of LG or other branded IoT devices, put them in an isolated test chamber and then try to decode all the RF noise come off them.

    That being said, all the technical requirements to do the things I suggested in my previous comment currently exist in those smart TVs. All that was preventing LG from doing that was consumer trust, and they've clearly thrown that in the garbage. At this point, based on previous behavior, it should be assumed that they will go as far as possible to exfil customer data without their consent or knowledge, until proven otherwise.

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  • [–] 1 point 3 weeks ago (2 children)

    Non-smart TVs are still available, they just cost a bit more. As for the connectivity issue, China has been caught hiding 5g chips in electrical control systems and city buses, and selling "free streaming" boxes with malware that scans networks and attacks targets deemed worth while. And all these TVs are being manufactured in China so why take the risk when you aren't going to use the connectivity anyway?

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  • [–] 1 point 3 weeks ago (2 children)

    Yep an isolated vlan with no internet access. Cast your media from a dongel or computer connected via hdmi.

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  • [–] 2 points 2 weeks ago* (1 child)

    In the video they explained that the TV seemed like it was trying to find and connect to any connection available (some routers allow auto-connection for easy integration). This would probably be a huge issue in an apartment building or townhome situation.

    I'm not entirely sure if they mentioned that was with Wifi enabled or disabled... But given that, even with the microphone input disabled, it records you from "other microphones" available, seemingly hidden, or through other devices connected to the TV... I assume they have a Wifi chip that is always enabled and searching.

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