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Debian developer Antoine Le Gonidec resigns after option allowing corporate LLM use without disclosure wins vote (lists.debian.org)
submitted 1 week ago by to c/linux@programming.dev
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[–] 9 points 6 days ago* (4 children)

Hot take: LLMs is the best thing has happened to open source movement:

  • software copyright is defeated and basically eliminated in practice
  • reverse engineering is so accessible that proprietary protocols cannot be hidden and can be reimplemented by AI agents as free software
  • open weight LLMs are incredibly competitive and run on general hardware
  • linux is de facto winner in all computing and rising in desktop and gaming niches

We're literally in the golden age of free software

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  • [–] 17 points 6 days ago (1 child)

    That would be cool and all, but people stopped reading their code. At work if I can not explain every line of my PR, it will get rejected. I use it as a powerful tool but a lot of people just output code and think their trash belongs in production.

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  • [–] 3 points 5 days ago (2 children)

    You're conflating open source and free software with public domain. Open source software licenses are completely dependent on software copyright. This means that if software copyright were eliminated, open source licenses would become completely unenforceable. We may be headed in this direction anyway, but I just thought I would make the point.

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  • [–] 2 points 5 days ago (2 children)

    It has been wild to see Linux users hope that the GPL is rendered unenforceable.

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  • [–] 1 point 5 days ago (1 child)

    Why? The entire purpose of GPL is to counteract copyright. If there is no copyright we no longer need GPL either.

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  • [–] 2 points 5 days ago* (2 children)

    The GPL gives you the right to access and modify the source code of software you use. A lack of copyrights does not mean that the creators have to share the source code with you. In fact, it means that anyone can take GPL software and turn it into closed source software

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  • [–] 1 point 5 days ago

    Sure but that's mostly irrelevant in practice now. Gpl was notoriously unenforced so this aspect of "getting source code" almost never yielded to much in practice. FSF did a great job with limited resources it has but as code copyright is basically gone now and reverse engineering is so accessible we can actually empower real free software that is fully transparent and verifiable. If you imply that somehow we'll start regressing existing tools to proprietary software I don't see that at all.

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  • [–] 1 point 5 days ago (1 child)

    Copyleft exists only because of copyright. If there is no copyright there's no longer a need for copyleft.

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  • [–] 1 point 4 days ago (1 child)

    I completely disagree. What's the main thing the GPL does that is different from public domain or the complete absence of copyright?

    It restricts how the code can be used in order to protect the writers and the consumers of the code. Without copyright and copyleft, any company can use any GPL code in any proprietary product they want, without sharing any of their changes and without even crediting the original writers. As an example, Microsoft could adopt the Linux kernel for Windows, heavily modify it, sell it, and stay completely silent about it, without any consequences. That's what a world without copyright means for copyleft.

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  • [–] 1 point 4 days ago (1 child)

    Sure but again this is only a problem if copyright exists. Stallman himself invented GPL due to frustrations of copyright. The permisiveness is default human behavior that was corrupted by evil people and terrible systems. The neutrrance of copyright just returns us to this default state of sharing.

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  • [–] 1 point 4 days ago*

    That's not true at all. Like I said, copyleft relies completely on copyright. It was not at all created in opposition to copyright. It was created in opposition to proprietary (i.e., "unfree") software. Here, from the Wikipedia article on Copyleft (emphasis mine):

    The concept of copyleft was described in Richard Stallman's GNU Manifesto in 1985, where he wrote:[6]

    GNU is not in the public domain. Everyone will be permitted to modify and redistribute GNU, but no distributor will be allowed to restrict its further redistribution. That is to say, proprietary modifications will not be allowed. I want to make sure that all versions of GNU remain free.

    This is impossible to do without copyright existing. Like I mentioned before, without copyright laws, companies can take any code they wish, with any license, and use it in their proprietary software without sharing their modifications.

    Another reference directly from the FSF: "Copyleft is a tool that works within copyright law" (emphasis mine)

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  • [–] 2 points 6 days ago

    Llms have been great for finding and fixing bugs and cranking out code, but the systems that allow for generation of code at a direct cost of dollars as opposed to the overhead of managing and employing programmers aren’t under the intense pressure to not redo old work and so are disincentivized from either creating or contributing to open source projects.

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