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[VENT] can westoids like myself ever be useful to the global south? (lemmygrad.ml)
submitted 4 days ago by to c/thedeprogram@lemmygrad.ml
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what it says on the title, we just violate and parasitize humanity and i don't even know if we should be kept around if a global revolution actually happens

i honestly feel like our only use right now is sheer body count and to be harvested for resources in a post-rev world, the latter being punishment for what we've done to the world

am i correct or just pessimistic? forgive me if my thoughts come off as off-putting but my frustrations toward my species leaves me wanting the global south to have a proper form of revenge

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[–] [S] 3 points 4 days ago* (1 child)

but given our parasitic relationship to the global south wouldn't we technically be enemies to the movement? or at least major hindrances, even if the west were to become socialist as well it'd still be stealing from the global south to my understanding

to me it feels morally incorrect to see us as working class because we benefit from exploiting humans

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  • [–] 10 points 4 days ago (1 child)

    Western society will need to go through an adjustment period where it suddenly cannot trade for goods with managerial services anymore. This will make most things very expensive in the West and it will force the Western colonies to simultaneously abandon many settlements while also developing more extractive industry. The extractive industry ramp up in the colonies will result in violent conflict with the indigenous folks and there will need to be international intervention to prevent genocides. All of this will result in a shrinking of the colonies, resulting in a concentrating of the colonists in less space, which will proletarianize them further as they need to build productive forces to meet their needs, which will turn them into productive members of the global proletariat and establish them as equal trading partners, eventually.

    It's going to take time. The colonies of the West will go through the worst adjustments. But Western Europe will also have to adjust as well, and they will more easily proletarianize and overthrow their legacy royalties and aristocracies in order to lessen the burden.

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  • [–] [S] -4 points 4 days ago (1 child)

    but wouldn't that leave us unpunished for our parasitic acts towards the global south? even if we did proletarianize we still act as parasites, our history can't be changed and needs to be addressed before we can be allowed into socialist civilization, if at all

    like you said, the animal gets violent when cornered and that's how all of us are innately, it's just part of being westoid and that innate violence is what concerns me

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  • [–] 10 points 4 days ago

    but wouldn’t that leave us unpunished for our parasitic acts towards the global south?

    You're thinking in moralistic terms. Punishment is only useful insofar as it produces sustainable material conditions. Most of the terrible violent sociopaths in the West will be punished by their own working classes when they rise up.

    even if we did proletarianize we still act as parasites

    You need to understand this from a material perspective. How do we act as parasites? It's not an individual choice. It's a relationship. The mechanism is called Unequal Exchange. When that mechanism breaks down, it will result in the costs of commodities increasing for the West, which will fundamentally change how they survive, which will, of necessity, drive us from parasitic to symbiotic over time.

    our history can’t be changed

    No history can ever be changed. And everyone in the world has histories of deeds that cause harm. So anything that starts with "we would have to be able to change our history" is not a real position.

    our history needs to be addressed before we can be allowed into socialist civilization, if at all

    No, that's also impossible. Reparations can only be made through the socialist process. Remember, everything is a historical process. The West and Socialist Civilization are not billiard balls that bump into each. The West and Socialist Civilization are two (of many) sub-processes of Human Society which is a sub-process of The Human Species which is a sub-process of Life On Earth, etc. There's no such thing as "allowing the West into socialist civilization". The processes that cause distinction between the Oppressor and the Oppressed gets resolved dialectically, that is to say with the oppressor and oppressed acting on each other and on themselves and on their context and resolving the contradiction, ending the historical process of distinction and simultaneously returning to the higher order process as a unity (human society) AND advancing to a new historical process (global cooperation).

    like you said, the animal gets violent when cornered and that’s how all of us are innately, it’s just part of being westoid and that innate violence is what concerns me

    Yes, the West will lash out. It's currently lashing out. Yes, there will be reactionaries, we've known this for a long time. Yes, the reactionaries will intensify their resistance, we learned this with the USSR. Yes the reactionaries will win some victories. But, reaction is ultimately unsustainable violent resistance in support of maintenance of violent subjugation is an internally contradictory process and it will ultimately cause its own undoing. Yes, it's concerning, because the violence of the reactionaries will be brutal, devastating, pernicious, and morally revolting. But, that's all the more reason why globally we need people, like you, who are aware of these things and are able to apply a level of reflection, self-control, and empathy to support the movement for global cooperation against those that would rather destroy us all.

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