▲ 82 ▼ The USSR was the spine of the global working class (thelemmy.club) submitted 5 months ago by yogthos@lemmy.ml to c/socialism@lemmy.ml 160 comments fedilink hide all child comments
[+] skye@lemmy.world -18 points 5 months ago (15 children) ??? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 15 child comments replies: [–] orc_princess@lemmy.ml 24 points 5 months ago (12 children) Capitalism requires Infinite growth in a finite world which historically frequently leads to powerful capitalist countries competing for who can colonize and brutalize other countries and peoples in search for resources and new markets. Western capitalism is built on top of the bodies of those who aren't western or benefiting from capitalism. Hence the claim you don't consider us human, otherwise you'd consider that even though almost every country out there is capitalist most countries are extremely poor and overexploited. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 12 child comments replies: [+] skye@lemmy.world -13 points 5 months ago (11 children) I see. My main point was limited to Europe and vicinity of the USSR. I did not mean for it to come off as dehumanising. I am more than aware of the faults and harm or capitalism, I am aware of how colonialism wrecked anything in it's path. To clarify: I was trying to explain how my country was poor, exploited and abused under soviet rule. I was trying to point out how these things did not just magically start after a change of regime, and that they were not happening before. Thank you for the clarification permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 11 child comments replies: [–] QinShiHuangsShlong@lemmy.ml 27 points 5 months ago (9 children) My main point was limited to Europe and vicinity of the USSR. I did not mean for it to come off as dehumanising. Deciding to arbitrarily ignore the largest most sophisticated immiseration machine in history to only look at the benefits for the core of the empire is disingenuous at best and very clearly dehumanising to the millions who suffered so the core could enjoy those benefits. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 9 child comments replies: [+] skye@lemmy.world -23 points 5 months ago (8 children) Aren't you people here also ignoring the misery people suffered only to look at the benefits of the core? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 8 child comments replies: [–] QinShiHuangsShlong@lemmy.ml 22 points 5 months ago Who is you people? I simply pointed out your framing of Europe as an independent entity from the mass immiseration it lead alongside the US for its own massive profit is arbitrary and dehuminising the pretty much the entire global south/periphery. Not to mind it being a bad start that leads to bad analysis and idiotic conclusions which I didn't bother to mention last time. permalink fedilink source parent [–] ZeroHora@lemmy.ml 16 points 5 months ago (4 children) Are you implying that USSR were part of the core? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] QinShiHuangsShlong@lemmy.ml 19 points 5 months ago I think they're implying that the RSFSR was a separate core and the rest of the republics were colonies permalink fedilink source parent [+] skye@lemmy.world -21 points 5 months ago (2 children) At the core of a system that claimed it's socialist, but kept spiraling more and more into totalitarianism and oppression? Yeah. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cowbee@lemmy.ml 21 points 5 months ago The USSR was not "totalitarian," and it wasn't imperialist. When people speak of the imperial "core," we mean the US Empire and Western Europe, whose wealth comes from plundering the global south. The USSR was socialist and not at all imperialist, it was not an "imperial core." Your defense of the imperial core based on their wealth ignores that it was gained through plunder. permalink fedilink source parent [–] RiverRock@lemmy.ml 11 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago) Oh I see, you have nothing so you're just coasting off of the same fairy tales and vague labels that don't actually say anything. God it must rule to be an anticommunist, you can just declare anything bad to be inexplicably communist and declare anything good to be Bad, Actually because something something no freedom no iphone, At What Cost? permalink fedilink source parent [–] BrainInABox@lemmy.ml 10 points 5 months ago No. Obviously permalink fedilink source parent [–] RiverRock@lemmy.ml 9 points 5 months ago What the fuck are you talking about you slug-brained no-u machine permalink fedilink source parent [–] BrainInABox@lemmy.ml 13 points 5 months ago I am more than aware of the faults and harm or capitalism, I am aware of how colonialism wrecked anything in it’s path. Clearly you aren't, if you think the prosperity of western Europe can be separated from the brutal exploitation it used to gain its wealth. Essentially saying "my main point was limited to plantation owners, I'm well aware how bad slavery was to the slaves". permalink fedilink source parent [–] mathemachristian@lemmy.ml 13 points 5 months ago "Most" of the capitalist countries exist outside of western europe, yet you convieniently ignore them. permalink fedilink source parent [–] BrainInABox@lemmy.ml 12 points 5 months ago Because you think western Europe was "most' of the capitalist world. Africa, India, and all the other places that very much were not thriving under capitalism don't exist to you permalink fedilink source parent
[–] orc_princess@lemmy.ml 24 points 5 months ago (12 children) Capitalism requires Infinite growth in a finite world which historically frequently leads to powerful capitalist countries competing for who can colonize and brutalize other countries and peoples in search for resources and new markets. Western capitalism is built on top of the bodies of those who aren't western or benefiting from capitalism. Hence the claim you don't consider us human, otherwise you'd consider that even though almost every country out there is capitalist most countries are extremely poor and overexploited. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 12 child comments replies: [+] skye@lemmy.world -13 points 5 months ago (11 children) I see. My main point was limited to Europe and vicinity of the USSR. I did not mean for it to come off as dehumanising. I am more than aware of the faults and harm or capitalism, I am aware of how colonialism wrecked anything in it's path. To clarify: I was trying to explain how my country was poor, exploited and abused under soviet rule. I was trying to point out how these things did not just magically start after a change of regime, and that they were not happening before. Thank you for the clarification permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 11 child comments replies: [–] QinShiHuangsShlong@lemmy.ml 27 points 5 months ago (9 children) My main point was limited to Europe and vicinity of the USSR. I did not mean for it to come off as dehumanising. Deciding to arbitrarily ignore the largest most sophisticated immiseration machine in history to only look at the benefits for the core of the empire is disingenuous at best and very clearly dehumanising to the millions who suffered so the core could enjoy those benefits. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 9 child comments replies: [+] skye@lemmy.world -23 points 5 months ago (8 children) Aren't you people here also ignoring the misery people suffered only to look at the benefits of the core? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 8 child comments replies: [–] QinShiHuangsShlong@lemmy.ml 22 points 5 months ago Who is you people? I simply pointed out your framing of Europe as an independent entity from the mass immiseration it lead alongside the US for its own massive profit is arbitrary and dehuminising the pretty much the entire global south/periphery. Not to mind it being a bad start that leads to bad analysis and idiotic conclusions which I didn't bother to mention last time. permalink fedilink source parent [–] ZeroHora@lemmy.ml 16 points 5 months ago (4 children) Are you implying that USSR were part of the core? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] QinShiHuangsShlong@lemmy.ml 19 points 5 months ago I think they're implying that the RSFSR was a separate core and the rest of the republics were colonies permalink fedilink source parent [+] skye@lemmy.world -21 points 5 months ago (2 children) At the core of a system that claimed it's socialist, but kept spiraling more and more into totalitarianism and oppression? Yeah. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cowbee@lemmy.ml 21 points 5 months ago The USSR was not "totalitarian," and it wasn't imperialist. When people speak of the imperial "core," we mean the US Empire and Western Europe, whose wealth comes from plundering the global south. The USSR was socialist and not at all imperialist, it was not an "imperial core." Your defense of the imperial core based on their wealth ignores that it was gained through plunder. permalink fedilink source parent [–] RiverRock@lemmy.ml 11 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago) Oh I see, you have nothing so you're just coasting off of the same fairy tales and vague labels that don't actually say anything. God it must rule to be an anticommunist, you can just declare anything bad to be inexplicably communist and declare anything good to be Bad, Actually because something something no freedom no iphone, At What Cost? permalink fedilink source parent [–] BrainInABox@lemmy.ml 10 points 5 months ago No. Obviously permalink fedilink source parent [–] RiverRock@lemmy.ml 9 points 5 months ago What the fuck are you talking about you slug-brained no-u machine permalink fedilink source parent [–] BrainInABox@lemmy.ml 13 points 5 months ago I am more than aware of the faults and harm or capitalism, I am aware of how colonialism wrecked anything in it’s path. Clearly you aren't, if you think the prosperity of western Europe can be separated from the brutal exploitation it used to gain its wealth. Essentially saying "my main point was limited to plantation owners, I'm well aware how bad slavery was to the slaves". permalink fedilink source parent
[+] skye@lemmy.world -13 points 5 months ago (11 children) I see. My main point was limited to Europe and vicinity of the USSR. I did not mean for it to come off as dehumanising. I am more than aware of the faults and harm or capitalism, I am aware of how colonialism wrecked anything in it's path. To clarify: I was trying to explain how my country was poor, exploited and abused under soviet rule. I was trying to point out how these things did not just magically start after a change of regime, and that they were not happening before. Thank you for the clarification permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 11 child comments replies: [–] QinShiHuangsShlong@lemmy.ml 27 points 5 months ago (9 children) My main point was limited to Europe and vicinity of the USSR. I did not mean for it to come off as dehumanising. Deciding to arbitrarily ignore the largest most sophisticated immiseration machine in history to only look at the benefits for the core of the empire is disingenuous at best and very clearly dehumanising to the millions who suffered so the core could enjoy those benefits. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 9 child comments replies: [+] skye@lemmy.world -23 points 5 months ago (8 children) Aren't you people here also ignoring the misery people suffered only to look at the benefits of the core? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 8 child comments replies: [–] QinShiHuangsShlong@lemmy.ml 22 points 5 months ago Who is you people? I simply pointed out your framing of Europe as an independent entity from the mass immiseration it lead alongside the US for its own massive profit is arbitrary and dehuminising the pretty much the entire global south/periphery. Not to mind it being a bad start that leads to bad analysis and idiotic conclusions which I didn't bother to mention last time. permalink fedilink source parent [–] ZeroHora@lemmy.ml 16 points 5 months ago (4 children) Are you implying that USSR were part of the core? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] QinShiHuangsShlong@lemmy.ml 19 points 5 months ago I think they're implying that the RSFSR was a separate core and the rest of the republics were colonies permalink fedilink source parent [+] skye@lemmy.world -21 points 5 months ago (2 children) At the core of a system that claimed it's socialist, but kept spiraling more and more into totalitarianism and oppression? Yeah. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cowbee@lemmy.ml 21 points 5 months ago The USSR was not "totalitarian," and it wasn't imperialist. When people speak of the imperial "core," we mean the US Empire and Western Europe, whose wealth comes from plundering the global south. The USSR was socialist and not at all imperialist, it was not an "imperial core." Your defense of the imperial core based on their wealth ignores that it was gained through plunder. permalink fedilink source parent [–] RiverRock@lemmy.ml 11 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago) Oh I see, you have nothing so you're just coasting off of the same fairy tales and vague labels that don't actually say anything. God it must rule to be an anticommunist, you can just declare anything bad to be inexplicably communist and declare anything good to be Bad, Actually because something something no freedom no iphone, At What Cost? permalink fedilink source parent [–] BrainInABox@lemmy.ml 10 points 5 months ago No. Obviously permalink fedilink source parent [–] RiverRock@lemmy.ml 9 points 5 months ago What the fuck are you talking about you slug-brained no-u machine permalink fedilink source parent [–] BrainInABox@lemmy.ml 13 points 5 months ago I am more than aware of the faults and harm or capitalism, I am aware of how colonialism wrecked anything in it’s path. Clearly you aren't, if you think the prosperity of western Europe can be separated from the brutal exploitation it used to gain its wealth. Essentially saying "my main point was limited to plantation owners, I'm well aware how bad slavery was to the slaves". permalink fedilink source parent
[–] QinShiHuangsShlong@lemmy.ml 27 points 5 months ago (9 children) My main point was limited to Europe and vicinity of the USSR. I did not mean for it to come off as dehumanising. Deciding to arbitrarily ignore the largest most sophisticated immiseration machine in history to only look at the benefits for the core of the empire is disingenuous at best and very clearly dehumanising to the millions who suffered so the core could enjoy those benefits. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 9 child comments replies: [+] skye@lemmy.world -23 points 5 months ago (8 children) Aren't you people here also ignoring the misery people suffered only to look at the benefits of the core? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 8 child comments replies: [–] QinShiHuangsShlong@lemmy.ml 22 points 5 months ago Who is you people? I simply pointed out your framing of Europe as an independent entity from the mass immiseration it lead alongside the US for its own massive profit is arbitrary and dehuminising the pretty much the entire global south/periphery. Not to mind it being a bad start that leads to bad analysis and idiotic conclusions which I didn't bother to mention last time. permalink fedilink source parent [–] ZeroHora@lemmy.ml 16 points 5 months ago (4 children) Are you implying that USSR were part of the core? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] QinShiHuangsShlong@lemmy.ml 19 points 5 months ago I think they're implying that the RSFSR was a separate core and the rest of the republics were colonies permalink fedilink source parent [+] skye@lemmy.world -21 points 5 months ago (2 children) At the core of a system that claimed it's socialist, but kept spiraling more and more into totalitarianism and oppression? Yeah. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cowbee@lemmy.ml 21 points 5 months ago The USSR was not "totalitarian," and it wasn't imperialist. When people speak of the imperial "core," we mean the US Empire and Western Europe, whose wealth comes from plundering the global south. The USSR was socialist and not at all imperialist, it was not an "imperial core." Your defense of the imperial core based on their wealth ignores that it was gained through plunder. permalink fedilink source parent [–] RiverRock@lemmy.ml 11 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago) Oh I see, you have nothing so you're just coasting off of the same fairy tales and vague labels that don't actually say anything. God it must rule to be an anticommunist, you can just declare anything bad to be inexplicably communist and declare anything good to be Bad, Actually because something something no freedom no iphone, At What Cost? permalink fedilink source parent [–] BrainInABox@lemmy.ml 10 points 5 months ago No. Obviously permalink fedilink source parent [–] RiverRock@lemmy.ml 9 points 5 months ago What the fuck are you talking about you slug-brained no-u machine permalink fedilink source parent
[+] skye@lemmy.world -23 points 5 months ago (8 children) Aren't you people here also ignoring the misery people suffered only to look at the benefits of the core? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 8 child comments replies: [–] QinShiHuangsShlong@lemmy.ml 22 points 5 months ago Who is you people? I simply pointed out your framing of Europe as an independent entity from the mass immiseration it lead alongside the US for its own massive profit is arbitrary and dehuminising the pretty much the entire global south/periphery. Not to mind it being a bad start that leads to bad analysis and idiotic conclusions which I didn't bother to mention last time. permalink fedilink source parent [–] ZeroHora@lemmy.ml 16 points 5 months ago (4 children) Are you implying that USSR were part of the core? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] QinShiHuangsShlong@lemmy.ml 19 points 5 months ago I think they're implying that the RSFSR was a separate core and the rest of the republics were colonies permalink fedilink source parent [+] skye@lemmy.world -21 points 5 months ago (2 children) At the core of a system that claimed it's socialist, but kept spiraling more and more into totalitarianism and oppression? Yeah. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cowbee@lemmy.ml 21 points 5 months ago The USSR was not "totalitarian," and it wasn't imperialist. When people speak of the imperial "core," we mean the US Empire and Western Europe, whose wealth comes from plundering the global south. The USSR was socialist and not at all imperialist, it was not an "imperial core." Your defense of the imperial core based on their wealth ignores that it was gained through plunder. permalink fedilink source parent [–] RiverRock@lemmy.ml 11 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago) Oh I see, you have nothing so you're just coasting off of the same fairy tales and vague labels that don't actually say anything. God it must rule to be an anticommunist, you can just declare anything bad to be inexplicably communist and declare anything good to be Bad, Actually because something something no freedom no iphone, At What Cost? permalink fedilink source parent [–] BrainInABox@lemmy.ml 10 points 5 months ago No. Obviously permalink fedilink source parent [–] RiverRock@lemmy.ml 9 points 5 months ago What the fuck are you talking about you slug-brained no-u machine permalink fedilink source parent
[–] QinShiHuangsShlong@lemmy.ml 22 points 5 months ago Who is you people? I simply pointed out your framing of Europe as an independent entity from the mass immiseration it lead alongside the US for its own massive profit is arbitrary and dehuminising the pretty much the entire global south/periphery. Not to mind it being a bad start that leads to bad analysis and idiotic conclusions which I didn't bother to mention last time. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] ZeroHora@lemmy.ml 16 points 5 months ago (4 children) Are you implying that USSR were part of the core? permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 4 child comments replies: [–] QinShiHuangsShlong@lemmy.ml 19 points 5 months ago I think they're implying that the RSFSR was a separate core and the rest of the republics were colonies permalink fedilink source parent [+] skye@lemmy.world -21 points 5 months ago (2 children) At the core of a system that claimed it's socialist, but kept spiraling more and more into totalitarianism and oppression? Yeah. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cowbee@lemmy.ml 21 points 5 months ago The USSR was not "totalitarian," and it wasn't imperialist. When people speak of the imperial "core," we mean the US Empire and Western Europe, whose wealth comes from plundering the global south. The USSR was socialist and not at all imperialist, it was not an "imperial core." Your defense of the imperial core based on their wealth ignores that it was gained through plunder. permalink fedilink source parent [–] RiverRock@lemmy.ml 11 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago) Oh I see, you have nothing so you're just coasting off of the same fairy tales and vague labels that don't actually say anything. God it must rule to be an anticommunist, you can just declare anything bad to be inexplicably communist and declare anything good to be Bad, Actually because something something no freedom no iphone, At What Cost? permalink fedilink source parent
[–] QinShiHuangsShlong@lemmy.ml 19 points 5 months ago I think they're implying that the RSFSR was a separate core and the rest of the republics were colonies permalink fedilink source parent
[+] skye@lemmy.world -21 points 5 months ago (2 children) At the core of a system that claimed it's socialist, but kept spiraling more and more into totalitarianism and oppression? Yeah. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] Cowbee@lemmy.ml 21 points 5 months ago The USSR was not "totalitarian," and it wasn't imperialist. When people speak of the imperial "core," we mean the US Empire and Western Europe, whose wealth comes from plundering the global south. The USSR was socialist and not at all imperialist, it was not an "imperial core." Your defense of the imperial core based on their wealth ignores that it was gained through plunder. permalink fedilink source parent [–] RiverRock@lemmy.ml 11 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago) Oh I see, you have nothing so you're just coasting off of the same fairy tales and vague labels that don't actually say anything. God it must rule to be an anticommunist, you can just declare anything bad to be inexplicably communist and declare anything good to be Bad, Actually because something something no freedom no iphone, At What Cost? permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Cowbee@lemmy.ml 21 points 5 months ago The USSR was not "totalitarian," and it wasn't imperialist. When people speak of the imperial "core," we mean the US Empire and Western Europe, whose wealth comes from plundering the global south. The USSR was socialist and not at all imperialist, it was not an "imperial core." Your defense of the imperial core based on their wealth ignores that it was gained through plunder. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] RiverRock@lemmy.ml 11 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago) Oh I see, you have nothing so you're just coasting off of the same fairy tales and vague labels that don't actually say anything. God it must rule to be an anticommunist, you can just declare anything bad to be inexplicably communist and declare anything good to be Bad, Actually because something something no freedom no iphone, At What Cost? permalink fedilink source parent
[–] RiverRock@lemmy.ml 9 points 5 months ago What the fuck are you talking about you slug-brained no-u machine permalink fedilink source parent
[–] BrainInABox@lemmy.ml 13 points 5 months ago I am more than aware of the faults and harm or capitalism, I am aware of how colonialism wrecked anything in it’s path. Clearly you aren't, if you think the prosperity of western Europe can be separated from the brutal exploitation it used to gain its wealth. Essentially saying "my main point was limited to plantation owners, I'm well aware how bad slavery was to the slaves". permalink fedilink source parent
[–] mathemachristian@lemmy.ml 13 points 5 months ago "Most" of the capitalist countries exist outside of western europe, yet you convieniently ignore them. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] BrainInABox@lemmy.ml 12 points 5 months ago Because you think western Europe was "most' of the capitalist world. Africa, India, and all the other places that very much were not thriving under capitalism don't exist to you permalink fedilink source parent
