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If you do, why do you believe in God? (lemmy.ml)
submitted 1 year ago by to c/asklemmy@lemmy.ml
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As simple as possible to summarize the best way you can, first, please. Feel free to expand after, or just say whatever you want lol. Honest question.

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[โ€“] 3 points 1 year ago (7 children)

If you zoom out on the universe it's almost pure noise. Does that resemble what you'd expect from a designer? I guess it could be designed, but there's also no reason to indicate that if pure randomness is also expect to create the same things.

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  • [โ€“] 2 points 1 year ago (5 children)

    I am unsure of the capacity of a designer, constructor, what label you want to call an input. To have noise there must be an initial force to create it regardless of its structure, randomness, pattern, form. A big bang, literally anything we may never know. But if the universe was static and blank with no energy or anything just a black sand box. There would be no noise until a reaction happened.

    I have never seen something come from nothing. I don't think anyone has ever or this question wouldn't have been asked or even be in our consciousness.

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  • [โ€“] 1 point 1 year ago (4 children)

    I have never seen something come from nothing. I don't think anyone has ever or this question wouldn't have been asked or even be in our consciousness.

    Well, particle and anti-particle pairs come into existence from nothing all the time actually. They typically annihilate though.

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  • [โ€“] 1 point 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (3 children)

    But they don't come into existence without an outside force. Those are first and second parties reacting. Who's the 3rd, 4th, 5th, END/START? Edit: Who spurs them into existence? Even if these pairs form and the sum is zero once the +1 and - 1 clash and the game zero sums. Who started or what started the spark something cannot come from nothing, this just means science must not have discovered the root cause of your equation. That is/was my only point. If things in the beginning were static, no movement, no input or output, someone/something adding an object, or kick off to start all of the events after whether they were involved or not. Just speaking on the OPs creator terms and not digressing into free will vs destiny.

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  • [โ€“] 1 point 1 year ago* (2 children)

    Who started or what started the spark something cannot come from nothing...

    No, they happen in relation to other things happening, but nothing creates them, especially not a someone. They just pop into existence. Why is that so hard to believe? Is it any less believable than needing some supernatural force to cause it? What created them? That wouldn't answer any questions anyway, so why would that be more believable.

    https://bigthink.com/starts-with-a-bang/something-from-nothing/

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pair_production

    If things in the beginning were static, no movement, no input or output...

    Things weren't static. They just weren't in general. Before the universe started and space-time came into existence, there was no space or time. There is no before, and there's no where to be static. At some point it just existed, not at any time, since time didn't exist. It's hard, or rather impossible, to really hold the concept in your mind because we can't imagine a timelessness, but that seems to be the case.

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  • [โ€“] 2 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    Those were wild reads, not only that but further study of the entire subject. I spent the last day combing the internet and it is very heavy stuff.

    I see and understand the process from nothing to something which I didn't previously have using matter and anti matter alongside other energy. Using quantum energy and all it entails given current science. Allowing different particles and matter to seemingly pop in and out is interesting and has came a long way since I last got educated. Its constant.

    That being said nothing science offers yet, gives an answer to my/or OPs creator question. Because regardless of theory and concepts and their are a ton! Science is all based on some form of pre existing structure, law, and or potential, and never absolutely nothing. We lack the models, proof, testing capabilities. The biggest models are string theory, and loop quantum gravity. Inside of the there are many concepts zero point energy, Tegmark, Loop Bounce, Vilenkin, Holographic origin, and on and on currently being evaluated.

    That leaves us currently having no truth to your view or mine, a stalemate for now. Without a new paradigm it's possibly unknowable.

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  • [โ€“] 1 point 1 year ago

    Yeah, no matter what there's no possible way to ever know how the universe came into existence. Since there is no time before it existed, nothing we can figure out really matters. It just exists for some reason.

    That said, the creator solution doesn't make sense to me. Its supposed to solve the question of how something came from nothing, but it doesn't. It just pushes it back further. The existence of the creator must now be explained. Where did they come from? It seems much simpler that the universe popped into existence from nothing rather than an intelligence popped into existence from nothing, then decides to create the universe.

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