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me🇺🇦irl (sh.itjust.works)
submitted 2 years ago by to c/me_irl@lemmy.world
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[–] -2 points 2 years ago* (5 children)

And you could have done the same and posted it for the rest of us instead of wagging your finger.

Number of ceasefires: https://kyivindependent.com/zelensky-gave-trump-list-of-all-ceasefires-violated-by-russia/

Number of talks: https://www.ukrinform.net/rubric-polytics/3784793-kuleba-ukraine-held-200-rounds-of-talks-with-russia-since-2014-but-that-did-not-stop-putin.html

The source for the meme appears to be a tweet from the Ukraine foreign minister. Zelensky has quoted similar numbers. These numbers are coming out of Ukrainian officials’ mouths and not 3rd party journalists and it’s not at all clear on how they’re counting since I can’t find easily any other sources.

Side note: with how bad Google is nowadays, people should never chide anyone else for being unable to locate a source themselves again.

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  • [–] 14 points 2 years ago* (4 children)

    "Russia violated all of the ceasefires and talks since 2014, but it is really important that the exact number is verified by 3rd parties."

    You dismissing the overall point by focusing on the absolute least important detail. If the number of talks and ceasefires is greater then zero and Russia has violated all of them, then why does it matter if there were two dozen or two hundred?

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  • [–] 4 points 2 years ago (3 children)

    Because details fucking matter, that’s why? It matters even if the side I’m on is the one potentially exaggerating. Don’t you care to know that? Or do the facts not matter to you anymore?

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  • [–] 8 points 2 years ago* (2 children)

    Because when someone starts arguing that there were 33 violations and not 35 or something along those lines I know they are just trying to derail the discussion away from the point that matters: Russia has consistently violated ceasefires and that is why security guarantees are needed.

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  • [–] 1 point 2 years ago (1 child)

    That’s an assumption that it differs by only a few from the truth. What if it’s off by a factor of 2? 5? You and I do not know.

    I want to believe the Ukrainians here because it would be confirmation bias. But it would be better to have reliable numbers from an unbiased sources.

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