Railcar8095 comments on Signal has been blocked by Venezuela and Russia

Signal has been blocked by Venezuela and Russia (www.theverge.com)

submitted 2 years ago by gytrash@feddit.uk to c/privacy@lemmy.ml

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"Signal is being blocked in Venezuela and Russia. The app is a popular choice for encrypted messaging and people trying to avoid government censorship, and the blocks appear to be part of a crackdown on internal dissent in both countries..."

[–] Railcar8095@lemm.ee 2 points 2 years ago (11 children)

Which ones? Signal? Likely. Secure mail and VPN? For sure. Can "foreign agents" use them? Certainly.

Who will have a hard time to use them? General population. Signal is the privacy communication service with the lowest barrier to entry, in terms of cost and setup complexity. Not a tool for spies, but for average Joe.

What service do you recommend BTW? That ensures government cannot snoop and prevents "foreign agents". It seems that any privacy is a risk, so I'm curious what a privacy minded person thinks should be OK.

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[–] RedWizard@hexbear.net 3 points 2 years ago (10 children)

"Likely"? "For sure"? So you have no idea of the opposition is using them, got it.

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[–] Railcar8095@lemm.ee 1 point 2 years ago* (9 children)

Yeah, I don't know. Do you? It's a fair assumption they use email, right? And VPN is standard in most organizations. I never even mentioned the opposition. Dissidents can be non affiliated people, who is discontent with their government or feel oppressed.

Why is it relevant? I thought you were interested about foreign agents? Or is all the opposition foreign agents?

Please tell me, should it be possible to have privacy from the government in Venezuela? If so, how? If you only answer one thing, please do this one.

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[–] RedWizard@hexbear.net 4 points 2 years ago (8 children)

Lol do you know how to migrate a community off one platform to another? Its about disrupting comms, not stopping them. Regular people will find other ways to communicate, as they always have. They have lots of options, as you've pointed out. I have no failings in understanding here. I told you already, signal is secure. Its security is backed by it's western intelligence financing. It has flaws in leaking meta data, just like matrix, proton mail, and any other means of encrypted communication tools. This move is to disrupt organized communication to make it disorganized.

No one needs to mention foreign agents. If you are able to observe and analyze the greater context for a given action you can arrive at an approximate rationale for the action. The west has a history of attempting to destabilize Venezuela, they back right wing dictators as successors, they regularly fund dissident groups who want nothing more then to violently take power in Venezuela.

Its clear that Venezuela is facing external pressure to dismantle their democracy, and are taking actions to disrupt those efforts.

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[–] Railcar8095@lemm.ee 0 points 2 years ago (7 children)

Lol do you know how to migrate a community off one platform to another?

"Foreign agents" could install a VPN, probably already have to send data. 0 impact whatsoever for those "agents". Even for casual privacy enthusiasts judge be easy, depending on what's already blocked. Average people on the other hand...

Regular people will find other ways to communicate, as they always have. They have lots of options, as you've pointed out.

Also pointed out how those present more challenges. Why you think WhatsApp and face time are popular, anybody can use them. I'm still wondering what alternative you propose. It seems there's nothing that suits privacy and making Maduro happy.

signal is secure. Its security is backed by it's western intelligence financing.

It's security is backed by the fact it can be audited. Of course governments want PQC encryption. You think other countries don't want or invest on it? The only difference here is that is pubic, free and can be checked for backdoors.

Its clear that Venezuela is facing external pressure to dismantle their democracy, and are taking actions to disrupt those efforts.

When preserving "democracy" is the excuse to not be Democratic, something is wrong.

I'm still waiting to know what do you think is a good alternative. You already complained that signal is secure against all parties, and I'm wondering of there's even a truly private messaging platform that is open and approved by Venezuela, Russia, China... Please enlighten me. There has to be at least one... Right?

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[–] RedWizard@hexbear.net 4 points 2 years ago (6 children)

When preserving "democracy" is the excuse to not be Democratic, something is wrong.

Ah there it is. Its only Democracy if it comes from the democracy region of the west. Got it. Venezuela has one of the most robust voting systems in the world. Requires voter finger prints, signatures, national ID cards, and has paper ballot verifications. Meanwhile elections in America can be decided by some elite cobal system established in the 18th century by rich property owners for the explicit intention of disregarding the will of its people to favor the property class.

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[–] Railcar8095@lemm.ee -1 points 2 years ago (5 children)

I see you have issues with focus, so I'll just ask again. What messaging system is private and has the approval of Venezuela, Russia, China...? Or is privacy against the state bad?

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[–] RedWizard@hexbear.net 5 points 2 years ago (4 children)

You are the one who lacks focus. This chain stared from this comment:

blocks appear to be part of a crackdown on internal dissent in both countries.

Or... you know... at least for Venezuela, the USA constantly fucking around with their elections and politics and local assets using Signal or something. Maybe, I dunno?

Do nation states have the right to defend themselves from foreign interference in their elections? What actions should a nation state take to ensure the security of its elections? What actions should a nation state take to combat misinformation spreading about their elections?

Based on your previous comments it sounds like you believe a nation should do nothing.

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[–] Railcar8095@lemm.ee -1 points 2 years ago (3 children)

Again, do Venezuelans deserve to be able to communicate privately?

Every state has the right to defend themselves, I'm a big supporter of Ukraine. But this is not that. You asked me of I know what apps the opposition use. Do you have proof that there are foreign agents and they use signal?

From a technical standpoint, this is useless. Only harms the population. If you believe this is wrong, please explain why this can't be bypassed with a VPN or proxy. I'm even forfeiting the proof that it's actively being used for "enemies of the state". And to west l what extend should Venezuela go? Lockdown from outside? Banning all encryption?

I have replied to all or nearly all your questions. If you don't intend to answer mine, then it's a waste of time.

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[–] RedWizard@hexbear.net 6 points 2 years ago (2 children)

I'm a big supporter of Ukraine. But this is not that.

I see your colors. Ukraine, historically, undemocratic due to western interference. Made the Communist Party illegal and disbanded it. Very good democracy there.

They are very much the same, except Venezuela is better at defending itself from said western interference.

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