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Your big brain conservtive/capitalist takes will be laughed at (lemmy.world)
submitted 3 years ago by to c/memes@lemmy.ml
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[–] 6 points 3 years ago* (12 children)

That’s not what fascist means. Fascism is specific a right wing ideology, because it involves close cooperation between the government and capitalist monopolies. Mussolini praised “capitalist production, captains of industries, modern entrepreneurs”. You seem to mean authoritarian.

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  • [–] 1 point 3 years ago (10 children)

    I understand the definition of fascism. You are missing the portion by which corporations are not allowed to exist if they do not further the efforts of the state. Basically exactly the same as Marx advised towards the end of his writings. Nothing is allowed to exist in a socialist system if it is perceived to work against the needs of the people (state)

    There is functionally no difference between corporations that do not control the means of production even if they are charged with running it and a state fully owning the means. It's just middle management.

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  • [–] 4 points 3 years ago (1 child)

    A socialist system doesn't have to be state-based. Socialism can encompass anarchism, anarcho-communism and many other left ideologies besides state-communism.

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  • [–] 1 point 3 years ago

    Just like the Soviets and CCP attempted to do before they learned how poor decentralized planning was without incentives. The CCP literally complained about how the Soviet Union wasn't following the true path of decentralized communes as their people starved. This is literally history. You can argue all you want about how what the Soviet Union and CCP became wasn't true anarchism but they literally tried it initially and it failed miserably.

    Even Karl Marx said that his intent was more of a direction than blueprints because he didn't have it all figured out. He also said that allowing opposition parties couldn't be allowed within any socialist system which cements the concentration of power and eventually consultation.

    All this is why the Western left turned to liberal reform approaches in the 50s.

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  • [–] 3 points 3 years ago (7 children)

    Okay, but that doesn't make a leftist system fascist. That's what authoritarian means in an economic sense. There are many other aspects of fascism.

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  • [–] 0 points 3 years ago (6 children)

    If there is functionally no difference between the systems, it it's fascism. Call a duck a duck. Oppressed people don't care that the flag is red.

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  • [–] 2 points 3 years ago (5 children)

    Fascism includes various types of oppression not present in other ideologies, such as sexism and manipulation/fear about minority groups as 'the enemy'.

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  • [–] 0 points 3 years ago (4 children)

    That is a result of the perception that those groups work against the state, not a requirement for fascism. Communist systems have just as bad if not worse a track record in regards to minority oppression as fascist ones.

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  • [–] 1 point 3 years ago (3 children)

    It's unfortunate as theoretically, communism is uniformly egalitarian while fascism is not.

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  • [–] 1 point 3 years ago* (2 children)

    I am sure that is why the Ukrainians starved during the Holodomor and the Russians did not. The tyranny of the majority still exists. It becomes far worse in a less efficient system with no economic outs for the state oppressed.

    Communism is the exact opposite of egalitarianism. It puts more power into the hands of those who control the government/decision making. There is nothing inherently less prejudiced about said government than any other but it does provide a documented incentive to oppress the opposition and the ultimate economic means to do so.

    Theoretically, a liberal economic order with the only central government mandate being protections for equality and justice is the only truly egalitarian solution that is not fascism.

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  • [–] 1 point 3 years ago (1 child)

    Sure, that's why I said theoretically and unfortunate. I was referring to oppression of minorities and women.

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  • [–] 1 point 3 years ago

    The examples I mentioned were minorities within their current societies. Socialism didn't prevent Stalin from banning abortion in 1939. Socialism is not inherently better for women's rights. It does provide more state power which means changes, good and bad can be more thoroughly implemented. This sometimes results in more thoroughly implemented social policy but often results in more effective genocide or no recourse for the oppressed at all.

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