▲ 562 ▼ i before e (thelemmy.club) submitted 2 weeks ago by ickplant@lemmy.world to c/funny@sh.itjust.works 67 comments fedilink hide all child comments
[–] woop_woop@lemmy.world 32 points 2 weeks ago* (43 children) ...except after "c" or when sounding like "ay", as in neighbor or weigh Neighbor Eight Beige Sleigh Received Foreign Weightlifters Follow the rule permalink fedilink source hideshow 43 child comments replies: [–] spizzat2@lemmy.zip 27 points 2 weeks ago (1 child) I'm seizing this! permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] BassTurd@lemmy.world 26 points 2 weeks ago I'm sorry to be the one to tell you this, but it's pronounced sayzing. It has to because of the rule. permalink fedilink source parent [–] icanbrewmushrooms@lemmy.world 18 points 2 weeks ago (27 children) How do you pronounce 'received'? (Or foreign, for that matter...) permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 27 child comments replies: [–] FlexibleToast@lemmy.world 14 points 2 weeks ago (8 children) It doesn't work all the time. English is full of nonsense like that. People always only remember half of this rule though. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 8 child comments replies: [–] W98BSoD@lemmy.dbzer0.com 13 points 2 weeks ago (7 children) Because English is three languages in a trench coat. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 7 child comments replies: [–] fartographer@lemmy.world 6 points 2 weeks ago (2 children) False. It's the runoff of a language-rich neighborhood. Stewing in a ditch filled with what looks like mud but smells like a dead family of possums at the bottom of a park trash can. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] W98BSoD@lemmy.dbzer0.com 2 points 2 weeks ago You isn’t wrong permalink fedilink source parent [+] mnemonicmonkeys@sh.itjust.works 1 point 2 weeks ago [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent [–] mnemonicmonkeys@sh.itjust.works 4 points 2 weeks ago Also funnily enough, it's arguably the most representative of the Germanic languages as a whole. It started out as a form of Central Germanic. Then during the Viking Age it was heavily influencd by a Northern Germanic language, Old Norse. Even the French influence is a very specific variety of French, since the Normans were actually descended from Vikings permalink fedilink source parent [–] Slovene85@sh.itjust.works 3 points 2 weeks ago (2 children) In a french coat permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] W98BSoD@lemmy.dbzer0.com 2 points 2 weeks ago (1 child) Hon hon hon! permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] Slovene85@sh.itjust.works 3 points 2 weeks ago Omelette du fromage? permalink fedilink source parent [–] tetris11@feddit.uk 5 points 2 weeks ago Four-Ay-Gun permalink fedilink source parent [–] JargonWagon@lemmy.world 4 points 2 weeks ago (2 children) "Received" would be the "except after C" part, not the "sounding like ay" part. Not sure about "foreign", or "leisure" for that matter. Maybe foreign used to be pronounced with the "ay" sound. I'm guessing something similar with leisure. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] nogooduser@lemmy.world 4 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) (1 child) The rule that I was taught as a kid was “I before E except after C only if the sound is ee” It catches all of the examples on the mug except “weird” which gets a pass in my book because it’s weird (Keith’s excluded because proper nouns don’t follow rules). It doesn’t catch “caffeine” but the “ei” in “caffeinated” isn’t pronounced ee where I come from. I’ve never heard the “ay” rule but it doesn’t seem to catch as many words as the “not ee” rule. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] LwL@lemmy.world 1 point 2 weeks ago Yeah the whole rule (and really the whole confusion) is about "ee". Other pronunciations are always spelt "ei" anyway. It still has exceptions but it catches a lot. And i wish people followed it because I die inside every time someone spells "Wiener" as "Weiner". The city is called Wien ffs. permalink fedilink source parent [–] Redjard@reddthat.com 3 points 2 weeks ago re-saved clearly permalink fedilink source parent [–] its_kim_love@lemmy.blahaj.zone -4 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) (12 children) Received is the except after C rule. Foreign uses the same ay sound as neighbor. Keith is a better one, but it's a proper noun so a lot of rules for spelling are ignored. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 12 child comments replies: [–] corvi@piefed.social 15 points 2 weeks ago (5 children) I’m sorry… foreign and neighbor do not use the same sound permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 5 child comments replies: [–] DrunkenDuckling@lemmus.org 3 points 2 weeks ago* They do but not where its_kim thinks: fȯr-ən nā-bər The "ei" in "foreign" is a schwa ( /ə/ ) and so is the "o" in neighbor. Sources (American English): https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/foreign, https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/neighbor permalink fedilink source parent [+] its_kim_love@lemmy.blahaj.zone -9 points 2 weeks ago (3 children) It does when you pronounce it correctly. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 3 child comments replies: [–] dharmacurious@slrpnk.net 7 points 2 weeks ago* Firstly, there is, effectively, no 'correct' way to pronounce any damn thing. Languages belong to those who use them. RP English is no more correct than Delhi English, or Alabama English for that matter. Secondly, I have English speaking friends from just about every US state, and so many countries, and I have never once heard one pronounce foreign as "fore-ayn." I'd love to know what dialect you speak. permalink fedilink source parent [–] DrunkenDuckling@lemmus.org 4 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) No... https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/neighbor nā-bər https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/foreign fȯr-ən You're probably speaking some fringe accent. permalink fedilink source parent [–] zarkanian@sh.itjust.works 0 points 2 weeks ago Nope. permalink fedilink source parent [–] LostCarcosan@lemmy.today 13 points 2 weeks ago (5 children) Foreign does not use the same sound as neighbor. nAYbor forEN permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 5 child comments replies: [–] bstix@feddit.dk 0 points 2 weeks ago (1 child) It does sound like forayn to me. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] DrunkenDuckling@lemmus.org 4 points 2 weeks ago* The most common pronounciations are "for-in" and "for-un". Source: English linguistics student who can read phonetic notation permalink fedilink source parent [+] its_kim_love@lemmy.blahaj.zone -7 points 2 weeks ago (2 children) It absolutely doesn't have a hard E vowel sound. Except when my deep south relatives say it. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] DrunkenDuckling@lemmus.org 4 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) Because it's not a "hard" E.... it's a mid-central vowel in "foreign" (schwa): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mid_central_vowel (like when going "uh") Proof in an American dictionary: https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/foreign While "ei" in "Neighbor" is NOT a schwa, it's an "ay": https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/neighbor permalink fedilink source parent [–] LostCarcosan@lemmy.today 1 point 2 weeks ago* Yes, you are correct that it does not have a hard E sound permalink fedilink source parent [–] Zarobi@aussie.zone 14 points 2 weeks ago (2 children) The actual rule is "memorise every word individually over a lifetime because there are no rules" permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] WorldsDumbestMan@lemmy.today 0 points 2 weeks ago (1 child) Just memorize the exceptions. It's better to memorize rules than words. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] Objection@lemmy.ml 3 points 2 weeks ago Not if the rules don't fucking work lol. permalink fedilink source parent [–] WolvenSpectre@lemmy.ca 12 points 2 weeks ago* You must pronounce Foreign in a strange way. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/I_before_E_except_after_C permalink fedilink source parent [–] jonathan7luke@lemmy.zip 10 points 2 weeks ago ... and you'll always be wrong no matter what you say! permalink fedilink source parent [–] atomicbocks@sh.itjust.works 7 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) (2 children) That’s not very scientific… Edit: Downvote why? ‘Science’ clearly doesn’t follow the rule. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] humorlessrepost@lemmy.world 5 points 2 weeks ago (1 child) Good point, need to add that it’s also only for diphthongs. Science doesn’t apply because the i and e are in different syllables. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] atomicbocks@sh.itjust.works 1 point 2 weeks ago Honestly I wish we would just stop teaching stupid ‘rules’ like this. English is easier to just remember than to try to suss out some sort of rule set by which you can magically spell a word you just heard or magically pronounce a word you have only read. I hated being told to sound shit out when I was a kid. It’s like “‘c’s make a ‘k’ or ‘s’ noise, sound it out”: Pacific Ocean Fucking really? permalink fedilink source parent [–] its_kim_love@lemmy.blahaj.zone 7 points 2 weeks ago or when sounding like "ay", as in neighbor or weigh And on weekends and holidays and all throughout may. You'll always be wrong no matter what you say! permalink fedilink source parent [+] otacon239@lemmy.world 1 point 2 weeks ago [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent [+] Screamium@lemmy.world 1 point 2 weeks ago [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent [–] UncleArthur@lemmy.world 1 point 2 weeks ago (1 child) The phrase I learned was "except after 'c' but only if the sound is 'ee'". Mostly also works. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] wolframhydroxide@sh.itjust.works 3 points 2 weeks ago As a scientist, I'm getting a seizure from people in society pretending like this is a useful rule. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] spizzat2@lemmy.zip 27 points 2 weeks ago (1 child) I'm seizing this! permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] BassTurd@lemmy.world 26 points 2 weeks ago I'm sorry to be the one to tell you this, but it's pronounced sayzing. It has to because of the rule. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] BassTurd@lemmy.world 26 points 2 weeks ago I'm sorry to be the one to tell you this, but it's pronounced sayzing. It has to because of the rule. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] icanbrewmushrooms@lemmy.world 18 points 2 weeks ago (27 children) How do you pronounce 'received'? (Or foreign, for that matter...) permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 27 child comments replies: [–] FlexibleToast@lemmy.world 14 points 2 weeks ago (8 children) It doesn't work all the time. English is full of nonsense like that. People always only remember half of this rule though. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 8 child comments replies: [–] W98BSoD@lemmy.dbzer0.com 13 points 2 weeks ago (7 children) Because English is three languages in a trench coat. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 7 child comments replies: [–] fartographer@lemmy.world 6 points 2 weeks ago (2 children) False. It's the runoff of a language-rich neighborhood. Stewing in a ditch filled with what looks like mud but smells like a dead family of possums at the bottom of a park trash can. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] W98BSoD@lemmy.dbzer0.com 2 points 2 weeks ago You isn’t wrong permalink fedilink source parent [+] mnemonicmonkeys@sh.itjust.works 1 point 2 weeks ago [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent [–] mnemonicmonkeys@sh.itjust.works 4 points 2 weeks ago Also funnily enough, it's arguably the most representative of the Germanic languages as a whole. It started out as a form of Central Germanic. Then during the Viking Age it was heavily influencd by a Northern Germanic language, Old Norse. Even the French influence is a very specific variety of French, since the Normans were actually descended from Vikings permalink fedilink source parent [–] Slovene85@sh.itjust.works 3 points 2 weeks ago (2 children) In a french coat permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] W98BSoD@lemmy.dbzer0.com 2 points 2 weeks ago (1 child) Hon hon hon! permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] Slovene85@sh.itjust.works 3 points 2 weeks ago Omelette du fromage? permalink fedilink source parent [–] tetris11@feddit.uk 5 points 2 weeks ago Four-Ay-Gun permalink fedilink source parent [–] JargonWagon@lemmy.world 4 points 2 weeks ago (2 children) "Received" would be the "except after C" part, not the "sounding like ay" part. Not sure about "foreign", or "leisure" for that matter. Maybe foreign used to be pronounced with the "ay" sound. I'm guessing something similar with leisure. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] nogooduser@lemmy.world 4 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) (1 child) The rule that I was taught as a kid was “I before E except after C only if the sound is ee” It catches all of the examples on the mug except “weird” which gets a pass in my book because it’s weird (Keith’s excluded because proper nouns don’t follow rules). It doesn’t catch “caffeine” but the “ei” in “caffeinated” isn’t pronounced ee where I come from. I’ve never heard the “ay” rule but it doesn’t seem to catch as many words as the “not ee” rule. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] LwL@lemmy.world 1 point 2 weeks ago Yeah the whole rule (and really the whole confusion) is about "ee". Other pronunciations are always spelt "ei" anyway. It still has exceptions but it catches a lot. And i wish people followed it because I die inside every time someone spells "Wiener" as "Weiner". The city is called Wien ffs. permalink fedilink source parent [–] Redjard@reddthat.com 3 points 2 weeks ago re-saved clearly permalink fedilink source parent [–] its_kim_love@lemmy.blahaj.zone -4 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) (12 children) Received is the except after C rule. Foreign uses the same ay sound as neighbor. Keith is a better one, but it's a proper noun so a lot of rules for spelling are ignored. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 12 child comments replies: [–] corvi@piefed.social 15 points 2 weeks ago (5 children) I’m sorry… foreign and neighbor do not use the same sound permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 5 child comments replies: [–] DrunkenDuckling@lemmus.org 3 points 2 weeks ago* They do but not where its_kim thinks: fȯr-ən nā-bər The "ei" in "foreign" is a schwa ( /ə/ ) and so is the "o" in neighbor. Sources (American English): https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/foreign, https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/neighbor permalink fedilink source parent [+] its_kim_love@lemmy.blahaj.zone -9 points 2 weeks ago (3 children) It does when you pronounce it correctly. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 3 child comments replies: [–] dharmacurious@slrpnk.net 7 points 2 weeks ago* Firstly, there is, effectively, no 'correct' way to pronounce any damn thing. Languages belong to those who use them. RP English is no more correct than Delhi English, or Alabama English for that matter. Secondly, I have English speaking friends from just about every US state, and so many countries, and I have never once heard one pronounce foreign as "fore-ayn." I'd love to know what dialect you speak. permalink fedilink source parent [–] DrunkenDuckling@lemmus.org 4 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) No... https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/neighbor nā-bər https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/foreign fȯr-ən You're probably speaking some fringe accent. permalink fedilink source parent [–] zarkanian@sh.itjust.works 0 points 2 weeks ago Nope. permalink fedilink source parent [–] LostCarcosan@lemmy.today 13 points 2 weeks ago (5 children) Foreign does not use the same sound as neighbor. nAYbor forEN permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 5 child comments replies: [–] bstix@feddit.dk 0 points 2 weeks ago (1 child) It does sound like forayn to me. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] DrunkenDuckling@lemmus.org 4 points 2 weeks ago* The most common pronounciations are "for-in" and "for-un". Source: English linguistics student who can read phonetic notation permalink fedilink source parent [+] its_kim_love@lemmy.blahaj.zone -7 points 2 weeks ago (2 children) It absolutely doesn't have a hard E vowel sound. Except when my deep south relatives say it. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] DrunkenDuckling@lemmus.org 4 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) Because it's not a "hard" E.... it's a mid-central vowel in "foreign" (schwa): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mid_central_vowel (like when going "uh") Proof in an American dictionary: https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/foreign While "ei" in "Neighbor" is NOT a schwa, it's an "ay": https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/neighbor permalink fedilink source parent [–] LostCarcosan@lemmy.today 1 point 2 weeks ago* Yes, you are correct that it does not have a hard E sound permalink fedilink source parent
[–] FlexibleToast@lemmy.world 14 points 2 weeks ago (8 children) It doesn't work all the time. English is full of nonsense like that. People always only remember half of this rule though. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 8 child comments replies: [–] W98BSoD@lemmy.dbzer0.com 13 points 2 weeks ago (7 children) Because English is three languages in a trench coat. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 7 child comments replies: [–] fartographer@lemmy.world 6 points 2 weeks ago (2 children) False. It's the runoff of a language-rich neighborhood. Stewing in a ditch filled with what looks like mud but smells like a dead family of possums at the bottom of a park trash can. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] W98BSoD@lemmy.dbzer0.com 2 points 2 weeks ago You isn’t wrong permalink fedilink source parent [+] mnemonicmonkeys@sh.itjust.works 1 point 2 weeks ago [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent [–] mnemonicmonkeys@sh.itjust.works 4 points 2 weeks ago Also funnily enough, it's arguably the most representative of the Germanic languages as a whole. It started out as a form of Central Germanic. Then during the Viking Age it was heavily influencd by a Northern Germanic language, Old Norse. Even the French influence is a very specific variety of French, since the Normans were actually descended from Vikings permalink fedilink source parent [–] Slovene85@sh.itjust.works 3 points 2 weeks ago (2 children) In a french coat permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] W98BSoD@lemmy.dbzer0.com 2 points 2 weeks ago (1 child) Hon hon hon! permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] Slovene85@sh.itjust.works 3 points 2 weeks ago Omelette du fromage? permalink fedilink source parent
[–] W98BSoD@lemmy.dbzer0.com 13 points 2 weeks ago (7 children) Because English is three languages in a trench coat. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 7 child comments replies: [–] fartographer@lemmy.world 6 points 2 weeks ago (2 children) False. It's the runoff of a language-rich neighborhood. Stewing in a ditch filled with what looks like mud but smells like a dead family of possums at the bottom of a park trash can. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] W98BSoD@lemmy.dbzer0.com 2 points 2 weeks ago You isn’t wrong permalink fedilink source parent [+] mnemonicmonkeys@sh.itjust.works 1 point 2 weeks ago [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent [–] mnemonicmonkeys@sh.itjust.works 4 points 2 weeks ago Also funnily enough, it's arguably the most representative of the Germanic languages as a whole. It started out as a form of Central Germanic. Then during the Viking Age it was heavily influencd by a Northern Germanic language, Old Norse. Even the French influence is a very specific variety of French, since the Normans were actually descended from Vikings permalink fedilink source parent [–] Slovene85@sh.itjust.works 3 points 2 weeks ago (2 children) In a french coat permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] W98BSoD@lemmy.dbzer0.com 2 points 2 weeks ago (1 child) Hon hon hon! permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] Slovene85@sh.itjust.works 3 points 2 weeks ago Omelette du fromage? permalink fedilink source parent
[–] fartographer@lemmy.world 6 points 2 weeks ago (2 children) False. It's the runoff of a language-rich neighborhood. Stewing in a ditch filled with what looks like mud but smells like a dead family of possums at the bottom of a park trash can. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] W98BSoD@lemmy.dbzer0.com 2 points 2 weeks ago You isn’t wrong permalink fedilink source parent [+] mnemonicmonkeys@sh.itjust.works 1 point 2 weeks ago [deleted] permalink fedilink source parent
[–] mnemonicmonkeys@sh.itjust.works 4 points 2 weeks ago Also funnily enough, it's arguably the most representative of the Germanic languages as a whole. It started out as a form of Central Germanic. Then during the Viking Age it was heavily influencd by a Northern Germanic language, Old Norse. Even the French influence is a very specific variety of French, since the Normans were actually descended from Vikings permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Slovene85@sh.itjust.works 3 points 2 weeks ago (2 children) In a french coat permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] W98BSoD@lemmy.dbzer0.com 2 points 2 weeks ago (1 child) Hon hon hon! permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] Slovene85@sh.itjust.works 3 points 2 weeks ago Omelette du fromage? permalink fedilink source parent
[–] W98BSoD@lemmy.dbzer0.com 2 points 2 weeks ago (1 child) Hon hon hon! permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] Slovene85@sh.itjust.works 3 points 2 weeks ago Omelette du fromage? permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Slovene85@sh.itjust.works 3 points 2 weeks ago Omelette du fromage? permalink fedilink source parent
[–] JargonWagon@lemmy.world 4 points 2 weeks ago (2 children) "Received" would be the "except after C" part, not the "sounding like ay" part. Not sure about "foreign", or "leisure" for that matter. Maybe foreign used to be pronounced with the "ay" sound. I'm guessing something similar with leisure. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] nogooduser@lemmy.world 4 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) (1 child) The rule that I was taught as a kid was “I before E except after C only if the sound is ee” It catches all of the examples on the mug except “weird” which gets a pass in my book because it’s weird (Keith’s excluded because proper nouns don’t follow rules). It doesn’t catch “caffeine” but the “ei” in “caffeinated” isn’t pronounced ee where I come from. I’ve never heard the “ay” rule but it doesn’t seem to catch as many words as the “not ee” rule. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] LwL@lemmy.world 1 point 2 weeks ago Yeah the whole rule (and really the whole confusion) is about "ee". Other pronunciations are always spelt "ei" anyway. It still has exceptions but it catches a lot. And i wish people followed it because I die inside every time someone spells "Wiener" as "Weiner". The city is called Wien ffs. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] nogooduser@lemmy.world 4 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) (1 child) The rule that I was taught as a kid was “I before E except after C only if the sound is ee” It catches all of the examples on the mug except “weird” which gets a pass in my book because it’s weird (Keith’s excluded because proper nouns don’t follow rules). It doesn’t catch “caffeine” but the “ei” in “caffeinated” isn’t pronounced ee where I come from. I’ve never heard the “ay” rule but it doesn’t seem to catch as many words as the “not ee” rule. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] LwL@lemmy.world 1 point 2 weeks ago Yeah the whole rule (and really the whole confusion) is about "ee". Other pronunciations are always spelt "ei" anyway. It still has exceptions but it catches a lot. And i wish people followed it because I die inside every time someone spells "Wiener" as "Weiner". The city is called Wien ffs. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] LwL@lemmy.world 1 point 2 weeks ago Yeah the whole rule (and really the whole confusion) is about "ee". Other pronunciations are always spelt "ei" anyway. It still has exceptions but it catches a lot. And i wish people followed it because I die inside every time someone spells "Wiener" as "Weiner". The city is called Wien ffs. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] its_kim_love@lemmy.blahaj.zone -4 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) (12 children) Received is the except after C rule. Foreign uses the same ay sound as neighbor. Keith is a better one, but it's a proper noun so a lot of rules for spelling are ignored. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 12 child comments replies: [–] corvi@piefed.social 15 points 2 weeks ago (5 children) I’m sorry… foreign and neighbor do not use the same sound permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 5 child comments replies: [–] DrunkenDuckling@lemmus.org 3 points 2 weeks ago* They do but not where its_kim thinks: fȯr-ən nā-bər The "ei" in "foreign" is a schwa ( /ə/ ) and so is the "o" in neighbor. Sources (American English): https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/foreign, https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/neighbor permalink fedilink source parent [+] its_kim_love@lemmy.blahaj.zone -9 points 2 weeks ago (3 children) It does when you pronounce it correctly. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 3 child comments replies: [–] dharmacurious@slrpnk.net 7 points 2 weeks ago* Firstly, there is, effectively, no 'correct' way to pronounce any damn thing. Languages belong to those who use them. RP English is no more correct than Delhi English, or Alabama English for that matter. Secondly, I have English speaking friends from just about every US state, and so many countries, and I have never once heard one pronounce foreign as "fore-ayn." I'd love to know what dialect you speak. permalink fedilink source parent [–] DrunkenDuckling@lemmus.org 4 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) No... https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/neighbor nā-bər https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/foreign fȯr-ən You're probably speaking some fringe accent. permalink fedilink source parent [–] zarkanian@sh.itjust.works 0 points 2 weeks ago Nope. permalink fedilink source parent [–] LostCarcosan@lemmy.today 13 points 2 weeks ago (5 children) Foreign does not use the same sound as neighbor. nAYbor forEN permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 5 child comments replies: [–] bstix@feddit.dk 0 points 2 weeks ago (1 child) It does sound like forayn to me. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] DrunkenDuckling@lemmus.org 4 points 2 weeks ago* The most common pronounciations are "for-in" and "for-un". Source: English linguistics student who can read phonetic notation permalink fedilink source parent [+] its_kim_love@lemmy.blahaj.zone -7 points 2 weeks ago (2 children) It absolutely doesn't have a hard E vowel sound. Except when my deep south relatives say it. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] DrunkenDuckling@lemmus.org 4 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) Because it's not a "hard" E.... it's a mid-central vowel in "foreign" (schwa): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mid_central_vowel (like when going "uh") Proof in an American dictionary: https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/foreign While "ei" in "Neighbor" is NOT a schwa, it's an "ay": https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/neighbor permalink fedilink source parent [–] LostCarcosan@lemmy.today 1 point 2 weeks ago* Yes, you are correct that it does not have a hard E sound permalink fedilink source parent
[–] corvi@piefed.social 15 points 2 weeks ago (5 children) I’m sorry… foreign and neighbor do not use the same sound permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 5 child comments replies: [–] DrunkenDuckling@lemmus.org 3 points 2 weeks ago* They do but not where its_kim thinks: fȯr-ən nā-bər The "ei" in "foreign" is a schwa ( /ə/ ) and so is the "o" in neighbor. Sources (American English): https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/foreign, https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/neighbor permalink fedilink source parent [+] its_kim_love@lemmy.blahaj.zone -9 points 2 weeks ago (3 children) It does when you pronounce it correctly. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 3 child comments replies: [–] dharmacurious@slrpnk.net 7 points 2 weeks ago* Firstly, there is, effectively, no 'correct' way to pronounce any damn thing. Languages belong to those who use them. RP English is no more correct than Delhi English, or Alabama English for that matter. Secondly, I have English speaking friends from just about every US state, and so many countries, and I have never once heard one pronounce foreign as "fore-ayn." I'd love to know what dialect you speak. permalink fedilink source parent [–] DrunkenDuckling@lemmus.org 4 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) No... https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/neighbor nā-bər https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/foreign fȯr-ən You're probably speaking some fringe accent. permalink fedilink source parent [–] zarkanian@sh.itjust.works 0 points 2 weeks ago Nope. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] DrunkenDuckling@lemmus.org 3 points 2 weeks ago* They do but not where its_kim thinks: fȯr-ən nā-bər The "ei" in "foreign" is a schwa ( /ə/ ) and so is the "o" in neighbor. Sources (American English): https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/foreign, https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/neighbor permalink fedilink source parent
[+] its_kim_love@lemmy.blahaj.zone -9 points 2 weeks ago (3 children) It does when you pronounce it correctly. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 3 child comments replies: [–] dharmacurious@slrpnk.net 7 points 2 weeks ago* Firstly, there is, effectively, no 'correct' way to pronounce any damn thing. Languages belong to those who use them. RP English is no more correct than Delhi English, or Alabama English for that matter. Secondly, I have English speaking friends from just about every US state, and so many countries, and I have never once heard one pronounce foreign as "fore-ayn." I'd love to know what dialect you speak. permalink fedilink source parent [–] DrunkenDuckling@lemmus.org 4 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) No... https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/neighbor nā-bər https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/foreign fȯr-ən You're probably speaking some fringe accent. permalink fedilink source parent [–] zarkanian@sh.itjust.works 0 points 2 weeks ago Nope. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] dharmacurious@slrpnk.net 7 points 2 weeks ago* Firstly, there is, effectively, no 'correct' way to pronounce any damn thing. Languages belong to those who use them. RP English is no more correct than Delhi English, or Alabama English for that matter. Secondly, I have English speaking friends from just about every US state, and so many countries, and I have never once heard one pronounce foreign as "fore-ayn." I'd love to know what dialect you speak. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] DrunkenDuckling@lemmus.org 4 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) No... https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/neighbor nā-bər https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/foreign fȯr-ən You're probably speaking some fringe accent. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] LostCarcosan@lemmy.today 13 points 2 weeks ago (5 children) Foreign does not use the same sound as neighbor. nAYbor forEN permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 5 child comments replies: [–] bstix@feddit.dk 0 points 2 weeks ago (1 child) It does sound like forayn to me. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] DrunkenDuckling@lemmus.org 4 points 2 weeks ago* The most common pronounciations are "for-in" and "for-un". Source: English linguistics student who can read phonetic notation permalink fedilink source parent [+] its_kim_love@lemmy.blahaj.zone -7 points 2 weeks ago (2 children) It absolutely doesn't have a hard E vowel sound. Except when my deep south relatives say it. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] DrunkenDuckling@lemmus.org 4 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) Because it's not a "hard" E.... it's a mid-central vowel in "foreign" (schwa): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mid_central_vowel (like when going "uh") Proof in an American dictionary: https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/foreign While "ei" in "Neighbor" is NOT a schwa, it's an "ay": https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/neighbor permalink fedilink source parent [–] LostCarcosan@lemmy.today 1 point 2 weeks ago* Yes, you are correct that it does not have a hard E sound permalink fedilink source parent
[–] bstix@feddit.dk 0 points 2 weeks ago (1 child) It does sound like forayn to me. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] DrunkenDuckling@lemmus.org 4 points 2 weeks ago* The most common pronounciations are "for-in" and "for-un". Source: English linguistics student who can read phonetic notation permalink fedilink source parent
[–] DrunkenDuckling@lemmus.org 4 points 2 weeks ago* The most common pronounciations are "for-in" and "for-un". Source: English linguistics student who can read phonetic notation permalink fedilink source parent
[+] its_kim_love@lemmy.blahaj.zone -7 points 2 weeks ago (2 children) It absolutely doesn't have a hard E vowel sound. Except when my deep south relatives say it. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] DrunkenDuckling@lemmus.org 4 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) Because it's not a "hard" E.... it's a mid-central vowel in "foreign" (schwa): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mid_central_vowel (like when going "uh") Proof in an American dictionary: https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/foreign While "ei" in "Neighbor" is NOT a schwa, it's an "ay": https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/neighbor permalink fedilink source parent [–] LostCarcosan@lemmy.today 1 point 2 weeks ago* Yes, you are correct that it does not have a hard E sound permalink fedilink source parent
[–] DrunkenDuckling@lemmus.org 4 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) Because it's not a "hard" E.... it's a mid-central vowel in "foreign" (schwa): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mid_central_vowel (like when going "uh") Proof in an American dictionary: https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/foreign While "ei" in "Neighbor" is NOT a schwa, it's an "ay": https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/neighbor permalink fedilink source parent
[–] LostCarcosan@lemmy.today 1 point 2 weeks ago* Yes, you are correct that it does not have a hard E sound permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Zarobi@aussie.zone 14 points 2 weeks ago (2 children) The actual rule is "memorise every word individually over a lifetime because there are no rules" permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] WorldsDumbestMan@lemmy.today 0 points 2 weeks ago (1 child) Just memorize the exceptions. It's better to memorize rules than words. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] Objection@lemmy.ml 3 points 2 weeks ago Not if the rules don't fucking work lol. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] WorldsDumbestMan@lemmy.today 0 points 2 weeks ago (1 child) Just memorize the exceptions. It's better to memorize rules than words. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] Objection@lemmy.ml 3 points 2 weeks ago Not if the rules don't fucking work lol. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] Objection@lemmy.ml 3 points 2 weeks ago Not if the rules don't fucking work lol. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] WolvenSpectre@lemmy.ca 12 points 2 weeks ago* You must pronounce Foreign in a strange way. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/I_before_E_except_after_C permalink fedilink source parent
[–] jonathan7luke@lemmy.zip 10 points 2 weeks ago ... and you'll always be wrong no matter what you say! permalink fedilink source parent
[–] atomicbocks@sh.itjust.works 7 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) (2 children) That’s not very scientific… Edit: Downvote why? ‘Science’ clearly doesn’t follow the rule. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 2 child comments replies: [–] humorlessrepost@lemmy.world 5 points 2 weeks ago (1 child) Good point, need to add that it’s also only for diphthongs. Science doesn’t apply because the i and e are in different syllables. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] atomicbocks@sh.itjust.works 1 point 2 weeks ago Honestly I wish we would just stop teaching stupid ‘rules’ like this. English is easier to just remember than to try to suss out some sort of rule set by which you can magically spell a word you just heard or magically pronounce a word you have only read. I hated being told to sound shit out when I was a kid. It’s like “‘c’s make a ‘k’ or ‘s’ noise, sound it out”: Pacific Ocean Fucking really? permalink fedilink source parent
[–] humorlessrepost@lemmy.world 5 points 2 weeks ago (1 child) Good point, need to add that it’s also only for diphthongs. Science doesn’t apply because the i and e are in different syllables. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] atomicbocks@sh.itjust.works 1 point 2 weeks ago Honestly I wish we would just stop teaching stupid ‘rules’ like this. English is easier to just remember than to try to suss out some sort of rule set by which you can magically spell a word you just heard or magically pronounce a word you have only read. I hated being told to sound shit out when I was a kid. It’s like “‘c’s make a ‘k’ or ‘s’ noise, sound it out”: Pacific Ocean Fucking really? permalink fedilink source parent
[–] atomicbocks@sh.itjust.works 1 point 2 weeks ago Honestly I wish we would just stop teaching stupid ‘rules’ like this. English is easier to just remember than to try to suss out some sort of rule set by which you can magically spell a word you just heard or magically pronounce a word you have only read. I hated being told to sound shit out when I was a kid. It’s like “‘c’s make a ‘k’ or ‘s’ noise, sound it out”: Pacific Ocean Fucking really? permalink fedilink source parent
[–] its_kim_love@lemmy.blahaj.zone 7 points 2 weeks ago or when sounding like "ay", as in neighbor or weigh And on weekends and holidays and all throughout may. You'll always be wrong no matter what you say! permalink fedilink source parent
[–] UncleArthur@lemmy.world 1 point 2 weeks ago (1 child) The phrase I learned was "except after 'c' but only if the sound is 'ee'". Mostly also works. permalink fedilink source parent hideshow 1 child comment replies: [–] wolframhydroxide@sh.itjust.works 3 points 2 weeks ago As a scientist, I'm getting a seizure from people in society pretending like this is a useful rule. permalink fedilink source parent
[–] wolframhydroxide@sh.itjust.works 3 points 2 weeks ago As a scientist, I'm getting a seizure from people in society pretending like this is a useful rule. permalink fedilink source parent