this post was submitted on 01 Jul 2023
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Why YSK: Beehaw defederated from Lemmy.World and Sh.itjust.works effectively shadowbanning anyone from those instances. You will not be able to interact with their users or posts.

Edit: A lot of people are asking why Beehaw did this. I want to keep this post informational and not color it with my personal opinion. I am adding a link to the Beehaw announcement if you are interested in reading it, you can form your own views. https://beehaw.org/post/567170

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[–] [email protected] 25 points 1 year ago (2 children)

As for the confusion / chaos around multiple/redundant/competing communities and so on...that will get better over time as people figure things out. Honestly it's not that different than reddit with all of its splinter subs like "true-" whatever.

That's true for just the duplication problem, but the defederation / shadow banning issue is not one that reddit has and is pretty confusing and poor user experience for new users coming in.

[–] [email protected] 23 points 1 year ago (3 children)

This isn't reddit 2.0. It's a different platform with different mechanics that hasn't had over a decade to mature.

Change is hard. People need to learn to adapt.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 1 year ago (2 children)

Right, but even non-reddit users would be confused by it. When everyone advertises lemmy as seamlessly integrating with all the different instances, it doesn't matter what instance your account is on, this definitely is not that.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 year ago

It's a young platform experiencing unprecedented growth. There's going to be growing pains where misunderstandings and misinformation are bound to happen. We need to correct the misinformation and set proper expectations.

The ability for a server admin to choose what servers they federate with is a core concept of the fediverse and needs to be properly communicated.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 year ago

The idea behind federation is, that individuals host their own instance and connect (federate) with others individual's instances.

But that's not easy for less tech savvy people.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Except you're not making a case for why they should rather than go to some other alternative once it pops up soon.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 year ago

One of us is confused, I'm not sure which. I'm not "making a case" for anything. I stated a fact, "Lemmy != Reddit". It's a completely different platform, with different underlying technology, that can perform a similar task. Anyone who's representing it as a 1:1 reddit clone that you can just hop to with no effort to learn how it works, is misleading others.

I'm not trying to win any arguments nor convince anyone to stay. If another alternative pops up, try it, if you like it use it. If you like lemmy use it. Hell, use them both or use neither. That's the benefit of having choices.

[–] [email protected] -5 points 1 year ago (4 children)

Expectation management... people need to stop pitching this on Reddit as the new Reddit then.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 1 year ago (1 children)

But… It is essentially identical in design to Reddit apart from the decentralised concept.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Which is a massive change that tbh I’m still not sold on.

Federation seems to cause more problems than it solves and it’s created so many fractured communities that it’s impossible to get involved in niche ones anymore.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 year ago

It’s definitely more messy. I suppose the reason i left Reddit was that the corporate structure ended up compromising their ability to live up to the responsibility of running a community space. As running the community became increasingly subordinate to revenue the decisions of the corporate body became increasingly out of whack with the best interests of the community. The federated concept feels like a possible solution to that problem.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 1 year ago

Well, new Reddit might easily mean better but also diffderent Reddit. Also, I am not sure whether people actually call it a new Reddit. Most of the time I heard the destription was a Reddit alternative which by definition doesn't imply that it's identical or even better in all ways.

[–] [email protected] -1 points 1 year ago

But… It is essentially identical in design to Reddit apart from the decentralised concept.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

I foresee a lot of issues with defederation and the proposed mod tools in the future, as well. They can refederate but it's not a good look for the platform when the federation can be fractured so easily. We have not seen the last of this issue.

I also question what it's going to look like when these moderation tools are implemented. Lemmy has more avenues for moderation/admin abuse than Reddit, and less recourse for users. There are a lot of concerns here that just seem to be swept under the rug under the pretence that "you can always go to another instance".

Ultimately it's not an issue with the function of the fediverse, but with the moderation philosophy of the people running these instances. Particularly when it comes to the viability of voting. That's a huge opportunity for suppression that I don't trust certain admins not to abuse.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 1 year ago

How does Lemmy have more avenues for admin abuse than Reddit? On either platform, the admins can technically do whatever they want. (Including editing users posts, spez). Lemmy makes it easier to just go somewhere else. At the end of the day that is all you can do.