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Traffic Camera Captures Woman Driving With Her Phone on Her Lap (Face Down), The State Mailed Her a $1251 'Public Safety' Ticket (www.gadgetreview.com)
submitted 3 months ago by to c/technology@lemmy.world
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A woman drives with both hands on the wheel. Her phone sits face-down on her lap. No officer pulls her over. No lights flash. Weeks later, a $1,251 ticket arrives in the mail. The evidence: a single frame from a Camera surveillance app. The charge: phone use while driving.

Automated camera companies market their devices as automated license plate readers — tools for catching stolen cars, flagging warrants, and aiding serious investigations.

Sold as a Crime Tool. Used as a Fine Machine.

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[–] 35 points 3 months ago (13 children)

Traffic cams violate our constitutional right to face our accuser in court.

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  • [–] 8 points 3 months ago (2 children)

    Wouldn’t you just need a police officer to go to court and say they are accusing you based on said evidence and then you still face the accuser

    The huge invasions of privacy seem like a much bigger issue but I am also not a legal expert

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  • [–] 5 points 3 months ago (1 child)

    The police officer didn't witness the crime. They're making that Judgement based on evidence provided by a third party.

    If my house were broken into, and I managed to capture video of the incident, I can't just hand that to the police and call it a day. The accused has a constitutionally protected right to face me in court, not just the video or the officer I gave the video to, so that their defense can interrogate it fully. What if there is additional context that undermines the narrative presented by this single piece of evidence? If I know the accused and had a reason to see them convicted (such as getting a kickback from any fine they pay), now my clear evidence becomes a little more suspect. Now there's a very clear motive for me to skew, misinterpret, or completely fabricate the video.

    That's what OP is referring to. If a company is going to install cameras and claim their cameras caught me doing something I shouldn't have, I have a right to ask that company for more details regarding their claim. Ideally in a public court, with a representative of the company under oath.

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  • [–] 2 points 3 months ago (4 children)

    Have you ever fought a traffic ticket? You’re not on trial. You’re not pleading guilty/not-guilty. It’s an administrative/civil thing.

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  • [–] 3 points 3 months ago (1 child)

    To be clear I live in Texas so maybe we do things differently wherever you live. We definitely go to court and plead for traffic violations.

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  • [–] 1 point 3 months ago

    MA. Tickets have "I'd like to pay" or "I'd like a hearing". No mention of guilt.

    Hearings are civil, not criminal, and you represent yourself in front of a magistrate (baby judge). If you tried to represent yourself in a criminal case, the judge would give you a very hard time about that choice. Either way, you don't call witnesses, there's no cross examination, and no discovery.

    I don't get where people are going full Law&Order, demanding to see their accuser.

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  • [–] 3 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago) (1 child)

    Every traffic ticket in the US I've seen requires you to check a box to plead before you pay it (assuming you aren't fighting it). When you pay it, you are either pleading guilty or no contest. If you go to your court date instead you get asked to enter a plea and it can be not guilty.

    Granted, I haven't been ticketed in all 50 states... yet.

    Edit: Apparently the click-bait headline is referencing a person from Australia, despite the rest of the article talking about US law... No idea how traffic tickets work there...

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  • [–] 0 points 3 months ago (3 children)

    It doesn't violate constitutional rights as long as whatever the camera can detect/see would be the same as a police officer. If it has a license plate reader and face detection or whatever it's unconstitutional because an officer probably wouldn't have been able to issue a ticket if it were a person there instead of a camera. If it's something like an obviously missing seatbelt or phone use seen through the window at a reasonable angle it's constitutional.

    I don't understand the "face an accuser in court" argument. It's a photo. You argue about the photo with the judge. The photo is your accuser.

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  • [–] 2 points 3 months ago

    Did you ever have a misunderstanding with someone that simply explaining it to each other cleared it up? How can a camera explain what it saw. The police officer wasn’t there and isn’t a witness. Also these cameras are not owned by the police. It’s a third party company that has a lease with them. So someone with no authority to make traffic stops is taking pictures of you and sending the bad stuff to police for money. Doesn’t that sound like a conflict of interest?

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