52
Controversial take: I dislike it when the efforts of me and my [american] comrades are treated like nothing, and the entire proletariat is thrown under the bus for not forming a revolution overnight (lemmygrad.ml)
submitted 8 months ago by to c/leftistinfighting@lemmygrad.ml
86 comments fedilink hide all child comments
 

Look, I actually have to spend my time around Americans. I dislike them probably more than a lot of people who say stuff like in [https://www.reddit.com/r/TankieTheDeprogram/s/eHww4UALHm](this thread). But it's not out of lack of trying.

But that's besides the point. No other country's people gets treated this way. And no, I'm not going to say I'm more oppressed than people in the global south or whatever. In fact a lot of psychological problems result from the fact that I'm privileged to be in the global north.

But Americans are so often...dismissed. That's the only term i can come up with. But everyone talks about it in such idealist matter. They always talk individuals or idealism or whatever. The closest to material analysis is "the proletariat's material conditions are closer aligned to the imperialist Bourgeoisie." But that doesn't just apply to Americans.

But, look. Why doesn't any other people get treated this way? Genuinely. I don't think Stalin sat down and said "well Germany lost a major world war and went through multiple economic crises and still hasn't had a socialist revolution. So obviously it's a lost cause, kill all of them." Japan and South Korea are never treated this way, despite being very arguably in similar boats. And if we want to talk about material conditions, what about Indonesia or Iran or Cambodia or so many other nations? They haven't had socialist revolutions yet despite their material conditions, so does that mean these people are useless treatlerites too?

I'm sorry. I know, again, we're in the imperial core, we're privileged. I don't know what part of my mentally ill brain it is, but it's just that the logic completely fails for me and that gives me anxiety, because reasons. Not just that, but the actual oppression of the communist and self determination movements here are also just ignored.

you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
[–] 56 points 8 months ago (5 children)

The North American left is not merely ineffective; it has been structurally neutralized and largely complicit. This is the population most directly sustained by imperial extraction, and it shows. Political activity has been reduced to NGO choreography, permitted marches, and aesthetic outrage that never threatens power. What they call “protest” is often just a safety valve for the system they claim to oppose, angry parades so to speak. Unlike even other imperial-core societies, North America sits at the command center. There is no occupation, no imposed austerity from above, no external pressure forcing confrontation. As a result, the left there has lost even the basic capacity to disrupt. Risk, discipline, and organization have been replaced by moral performance, social capital accumulation, and endless denunciation—while the material machinery of domination continues uninterrupted. From the periphery, this looks obscene. Entire societies are immiserated, destabilized, or destroyed to maintain this system, while those closest to the lever of power treat politics as a lifestyle. The issue is not repression alone; it is that large sections of the “left” are materially invested in stability, whether through labor privileges, NGOs, or proximity to empire. Real struggle would threaten their position, so it never materializes. This is why your comparisons fail. Elsewhere, even under worse conditions, left movements have had to contend with survival, sovereignty, and direct coercion. In North America, the left has been absorbed, declawed, and turned inward. What remains is not a revolutionary force but a managed constituency: loud, angry, and ultimately harmless.

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • hideshow 10 child comments
    •
  • [–] 14 points 8 months ago (2 children)

    Good points. The contradictions seem to hold them in place though. On one hand, you have complete militarization, both mentally and physically, you have a relatively comfortable situation for a lot of them but also a huge drug infusion which takes out a large portion of the otherwise probably disruptive groups, you have 24/7 propaganda of the highest quality, the therapy and psychiatric industry which all work stabilizing.

    I think its not smart to individualize this situation and try to point at the imperial core leftists. Of course they have to do something and I think a lot will be working on it right now.

    Therefore I would rather suggest op turn on their revolutionary optimism and build a local group, join a union and get started.

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 4 child comments
    •
  • [–] 20 points 8 months ago (1 child)

    I’m not individualizing anything. I’m describing a structural condition, seen clearly from outside the imperial core. The U.S. left is shaped by its material position inside empire, not by a lack of sincerity.

    Unions are a good example. In the core they’ve been neutralized and folded into labor management. Legalism, no-strike clauses, bureaucratic leadership, and state integration have turned them into tools for disciplining workers and stabilizing capital, not confronting it. They were broken precisely because they were once militant; what remains is the form that empire can tolerate.

    “Local groups” follow the same pattern. They’re allowed to exist as long as they stay small, visible, fragmented, and symbolic. NGO logic, surveillance, and subcultural politics keep them inward-facing. Anything disciplined, durable, or capable of escalation is isolated or dissolved. That’s not accidental.

    From the periphery, it’s also obvious that the imperial core rarely needs open violence against its own population. Control is mostly psychological and material. Propaganda, career risk, housing insecurity, debt, and social punishment train people to self-censor and self-repress. Fear of losing stability does the job long before police ever have to.

    That’s why I feel calls for “optimism” or generic organizing miss the point. The problem isn’t effort; it’s that the dominant forms of organizing in the core are designed to be safe for the system. Until that’s confronted, activity will continue to look radical while remaining harmless.

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 2 child comments
    •
  • [–] 9 points 8 months ago

    Yes, my thoughts exactly. I do come to a different conclusion as there is no other option than revolutionary optimism when facing this dire straight. We have the same issue in germany where people are somewhat comfortable, social pressure and "common sense" leads them to self repression. There arent any local groups, there are like two unions and everything else is gone. The reason why i say people need to do local work and use revolutionary optimism is because the situation has changed dramatically since covid and we can use this to gain a better foothold. Building grouls where there were none is a sign that the time wasnt right before and that the situation is giving us an in now. I will definitely keep organizing in a low visibility, highly beneficial to the local people manner as to stengthen the cogesion of the neighborhood and push our ideology.

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • parent
  • [–] 17 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago) (1 child)

    you have a relatively comfortable situation for a lot of them but also a huge drug infusion which takes out a large portion of the otherwise probably disruptive groups, you have 24/7 propaganda of the highest quality, the therapy and psychiatric industry which all work stabilizing.

    Good points. The numbing effect of drugs (both illegal and legal - especially psychopharma) and the therapy industrial complex is often overlooked, but especially in the US these play a crucial role in how the ruling class keeps the population docile and under control, in addition to the more well known methods like propaganda and material treats.

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 2 child comments
    •
  • [–] 15 points 8 months ago

    I kept telling therapists I didn't want a pill to make me feel better about crappy situations, I wanted people to roll up their sleeves and help me fix it. I finally got off all that crap with weed and am off that too. I also am wanting on energy the last year or so.

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • parent