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nooo my genderinos (mander.xyz)
submitted 1 year ago by to c/science_memes@mander.xyz
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[–] 2 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (6 children)

I don't entirely agree, because gender identity is known to be at least partially biological, e.g. there are correlations between transgender, skin elasticity, and hyper-flexibility.

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  • [–] 6 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (5 children)

    just FYI, "transgenderism" is a word to avoid (at least if you don't want to be perceived as transphobic)

    and yes, gender identity seems to be biological, and genetic.

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  • [–] 3 points 1 year ago (4 children)

    my bad, updated to "transgender," I read online that's the preferred noun form (though it looks more adjectival to me)

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  • [–] 4 points 1 year ago* (3 children)

    I think in clinical and scientific contexts the term "gender dysphoria" is used, but the trans community would probably prefer trans be used as an adjective and not a noun, someone is transgender, but not "a transgender", if that makes sense.

    also, the twin studies show gender identity is genetic and heritable:

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Causes_of_gender_incongruence

    The significant percentage of identical twin pairs in which both twins are trans and the virtual absence of dizygotic twins (raised in the same family at the same time) in which both were trans would provide evidence that transgender identity is significantly influenced by genetics if both sets were raised in different families.

    In 2018 a review of family and twin studies found that there was "significant and consistent evidence" for gender identity being genetically heritable.

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  • [–] 2 points 1 year ago* (2 children)

    gender dysphoria is not what I'm talking about, since not all transgender people have dysphoria.

    To be clear -- "transgender" the noun is not referring to a person ("that person is a transgender"* -- proscribed) but rather as a substitute for "transgenderism"* (proscribed). Personally, using "transgender" seems linguistically strange to me and it just reminds me of Trump saying "transgender for everybody" but if it's what people prefer then who am I to judge.

    Anyway -- yes, I agree that it seems very probable that there are strong genetic components to transgender, but it's also clearly not purely genetic, given there are identical twins where one is cis and the other not.

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  • [–] 3 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    gender dysphoria is not what I'm talking about, since not all transgender people have dysphoria

    right, I get that, but most research has not treated being trans outside the context of gender dysphoria, so when talking about studies or the clinical and scientific context usually non-binary and non-dysphoric trans folks are left out of the picture.

    It is good to be expansive in our concept of being trans for social justice reasons, and to not gatekeep for harm reduction reasons, but since scientists and clinicians are gatekeepers, what we can say about their findings are limited to the criteria they use. It is usually more accurate to say "a study found X or Y about people with gender dysphoria", even though it's not uncommon for that to be presented as "a study found X or Y about trans people" in more mainstream contexts.

    To be clear -- "transgender" the noun is not referring to a person ("that person is a transgender"* -- proscribed) but rather as a substitute for "transgenderism"* (proscribed).

    I have never seen this usage, and like you I'm skeptical that is right. I could see "being transgender" as a substitute for "transgenderism", but not just "transgender".

    but it's also clearly not purely genetic, given there are identical twins where one is cis and the other not.

    The presence of identical twins where one is cis and one is trans is not proof that gender identity is not genetic - there are many reasons people do not transition or acknowledge their gender identity, such as the strong social pressure to not be trans. There can also be epigenetic differences so while identical twins may share a genome, how it is expressed differs based on a variety of conditions that alter epigenetics, such as stress or illness.

    We see the same with sexual orientation by the way.

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  • [–] 1 point 1 year ago*

    Granted, it's not proof, but I find it very hard to believe that all cases of identical twins with apparently differing gender identities is explained by one of the twins simply electing not to transition while the other does. This is particularly hard to believe given that the twins grow up in similar environments, so if one is in a transition-hostile environment the other likely is as well. I think we should believe people when they insist they are not transgender, especially if they are part of a study where their identical twin is comfortable being open about it. If this were a rare occurrence, I would be more inclined to agree with you, but it is not rare at all.

    "transgender"

    One instance where I have seen "transgender" used this way is from the same article where I learned about the link between transgender, skin elasticity, and hyperflexibility:

    it’s at least possible that EDS and transgender are linked

    It's no typo; other articles by this same author use the same grammar. I have also for sure seen this used on other sites, including by trans authors, but in 5 minutes of searching I can't find those instances. "Being transgender" does seem grammatically fitting to me, but it doesn't always make sense to use "being transgender" as a substitute for "transgenderism"*/"transgender." Anyway we more or less agree here and I have little interest in semantics.

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