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Qwant and Ecosia debut Staan, a European search index that aims to take on Big Tech (techcrunch.com)
submitted 1 year ago by [M] to c/buyeuropean@feddit.uk
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[โ€“] 58 points 1 year ago (3 children)

While I'm glad to see Qwant and Ecosia's progress, I have to say a search index "designed specifically for LLMs and generative AI agents" was not quite what I was hoping for when I saw this pop up.

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  • [โ€“] 15 points 1 year ago (3 children)

    Yeah, I was also under the impression that they will create proper search engine for regular users, the AI crap is cancer

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  • [โ€“] 2 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

    I was also under the impression that they will create proper search engine for regular users

    It is a proper search engine for regular users

    It will power regular search results:

    Called European Search Perspective (EUSP), the JV now aims to serve around 50% of French queries and 33% of German queries by the end of the year.

    And it also has an API ๐Ÿซจ that AI search engines can use

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  • [โ€“] 2 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    It might be a bit naive, but here's to hoping that it's just a stepping stone for a proper alternative search engine.

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  • [โ€“] 7 points 1 year ago*

    How I imagine the conversation went

    Qwant, Ecosia:

    • we want to build an independent web search index that will greatly benefit European people, European economy, European tech industry and breaks the US monopoly on this area

    Government official:

    • I have no idea what you are talking about but here is a 200 page grant request that you can fill up and if it is accepted can maybe get 5000โ‚ฌ in 2 years
    • We want to build a search index WITH AI !
    • OO , I'm calling the president ! you'll get billions of โ‚ฌ.
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  • [โ€“] 2 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    Yeah I really would prefer we moved away from it... but unfortunately I'm not sure that's possible. EU can't afford to ignore AI either.

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  • [โ€“] 10 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    EU can't afford to ignore AI either.

    Can't afford to set fire to large piles of money?

    I'm being slightly flippant but I don't really understand what you meant by that.

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  • [โ€“] 5 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    EU can't be in a technological disadvantage when it comes to AI. Of course it wants to make it possible for European AI devs to have support, like a search index that also conveniently has the potential of favoring information that aligns with EU interests.

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  • [โ€“] 5 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    EU can't be in a technological disadvantage when it comes to AI.

    I think we might be at an impasse as "AI" currently seems to be a solution looking for a problem as far as I can see. Not that LLMs are completely worthless but the "hoover up the internet and hope something useful comes from it" approach seems to be a bit of a technological cul-de-sac that I think the EU would be better off ignoring. Let the other nations spaff money and resources on it, learn from their mistakes, then make a move. We're long past first-mover advantage after all, so we'd only be playing catch-up. Why not just wait a bit and leapfrog?

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  • [โ€“] 0 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    Not that LLMs are completely worthless but the โ€œhoover up the internet and hope something useful comes from itโ€

    You're saying that currently AI does not help with anything?

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  • [โ€“] 1 point 1 year ago (1 child)

    I've not found them reliably useful in a personal or professional capacity for anything other than trivial tasks. I've spent a lot of time reviewing code written by LLMs and it was not a good use of my time.

    A technology that is inherently unreliable and requires constant supervision needs to be on the level of nuclear fission to be worth the hassle, in my view.

    Note that I specifically am talking about "hoover up the internet" LLMs, not specialist tools built on scientific datasets or whatever.

    It can summarise my email? Fantastic, except it cannot be relied on to do a good job so I might as well do the reading myself as at least that way the data I'm getting is correct.

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  • [โ€“] -2 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 child)

    deleted by creator PIEFED

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  • [โ€“] 1 point 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 child)

    Sigh, no, I just didn't feel like writing more of an essay. Presume away though because we're done here.

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  • [โ€“] 0 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    search has been using ai under the hood for many years, long before llms came along. that's why google has had so much ai research, even back in like 2012. it's one of the best ways to keep track of that much data.

    like it or not the field is very useful, llms are just a rather stupid user-facing part.

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  • [โ€“] 2 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    Hey if they're actually useful then that's fine! The useful stuff hasn't really been what the AI bros have been pushing in recent years.

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  • [โ€“] 1 point 1 year ago (1 child)

    no, that's fair. we usually don't see the useful stuff because it doesn't need hype and just shows up as a data point.

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