zloubida comments on What's your opinion on Esperanto (language)?

What's your opinion on Esperanto (language)? (en.wikipedia.org)

submitted 2 years ago by NateNate60@lemmy.world to c/socialism@lemmy.ml

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Apparently the language was popular among early 20th century socialist movements because it was of an international character and therefore not associated with any nationality and its use by international socialist organisations wouldn't show favour to any particular country. It was banned in Nazi Germany and other fascist states because of its association with the left wing, with anti-nationalism, and because its creator was Jewish. It has mostly languished since then but still has around 2 million speakers with about 1,000 native speakers.

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[–] zloubida@lemmy.world 17 points 2 years ago (19 children)

who can I speak Esperanto with?

A lot of people actually, around 2 millions on the internet only. More than you can possibly meet in your lifetime, so that's not an issue.

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[+] fartsparkles@sh.itjust.works 3 points 2 years ago (1 child)

[deleted]

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[–] whydudothatdrcrane@lemmy.ml 3 points 2 years ago

Well there is a standardized system of foreign language skills, which is called A1, A2, A3,..., all the way up to C2. I think that it is only a matter of gathering statistical data to know what percentage of speakers are conversational. It is not an "unknowable unknown".

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[–] lipilee@feddit.nl 1 point 2 years ago (16 children)

2 million out of 8 billion is kind of an issue.

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[–] frightful_hobgoblin@lemmy.ml 11 points 2 years ago (6 children)

Not really. That's about average, or above average

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[–] zloubida@lemmy.world 10 points 2 years ago (5 children)

The national language of one of my countries is spoken by 300'000 persons.

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[–] lipilee@feddit.nl 2 points 2 years ago (4 children)

That's wonderful, but hardly relevant :) My point was: creating a language specifically for easing comms between people, and then have 2 million people speak that language out of 8 bln, while there are multiple other general use languages that are spoken by billions of ppl, just doesn't make sense. Case in point: we have this conversation in one of those, and it's neither your, nor my native tongue.

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[–] zloubida@lemmy.world 4 points 2 years ago (3 children)

Case in point: we have this conversation in one of those, and it's neither your, nor my native tongue.

And I'm pretty sure you have a college diploma. English as an international language works, but not for everybody, while Esperanto could, and when it works it reinforces the Empire, while Esperanto wouldn't.

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[–] whydudothatdrcrane@lemmy.ml 2 points 2 years ago

but not for everybody

I second that. English is all but useless in some places in Europe and Asia.

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[–] lipilee@feddit.nl 1 point 2 years ago (1 child)

Diploma or not, i feel if you want to learn one language to get around in the world, there are many better options than esperanto. English one of them but hey, spanish would work too, if you go to south america... I also think english by now is a common treasure for humanity, and not related to one country or empire. It evolved into a simple enough language so that you can very easily pick it up to a level where you can get around in most of the world. Anyhow, i wish all the best to all ppl learning esperanto, I'll keep on struggling with my Dutch, and then maybe spanish or turkish :)

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[–] zloubida@lemmy.world 1 point 2 years ago

Diploma or not, i feel if you want to learn one language to get around in the world, there are many better options than esperanto.

That's indubitably true ^^.

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[–] ExtremeDullard@lemmy.sdf.org 5 points 2 years ago* (7 children)

I meant in real life, in ordinary everyday settings. I can also "speak" Morse code with fellow hams on the air, or practice sign language at my local community college, but those are "forced" venues so-to-speak. It's not like I can routinely speak Esperanto every day as a matter of course.

2 million Esperanto speakers is 0.025% of the world's population, which works out as 1 Esperanto speaker every 360,000 square miles where I live. I still haven't met that guy.

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[–] zloubida@lemmy.world 6 points 2 years ago (5 children)

It's true that the problem is that it's a diaspora. But that doesn't change the fact that it's quite easy to find Esperanto speakers, and thanks to internet the Esperanto community is actually international. To be an active member of this community builds a better understanding of other points of view, it “internationalizes” your self. As a socialist I think that this is important.

English do that too, but not with the same deepness (I know, English is my second language).

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[–] frightful_hobgoblin@lemmy.ml 2 points 2 years ago

Do you know about the links between Esperantism and socialism?

Stalin, Ho Chi Ming and James Connolly were Esperantists. Hitler threw rocks at it in Mein Kampf.

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[–] ExtremeDullard@lemmy.sdf.org -1 points 2 years ago* (3 children)

As a socialist I think that this is important.

If you think languages and socialism have anything to do with each other, you're sorely mistaken. You can be a socialist - or a communist, a capitalist pigdog, or a Nazi or anything at all - and speak any language you want. Case in point: Hebrew.

You speaking Esperanto doesn't say anything about your political leanings. All it says is that you're interested in languages.

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[–] zloubida@lemmy.world 5 points 2 years ago (2 children)

Of course, I met some fascists in.the Esperanto community. You obviously didn't understood what I said.

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[–] ExtremeDullard@lemmy.sdf.org -1 points 2 years ago (1 child)

I understood what you said. The gist of my reply is: if you want to "internationalize" yourself, speak English. It's the lingua franca of the world. Soon to be replaced by Cantonese no doubt though 🙂

My point was, the language you - or the world - speaks has nothing to do with your political or societal values.

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[–] redrumBot@lemmy.ml 3 points 2 years ago

Culture and language have been used for the oppression of national minorities and to settle colonial and imperialist projects. The English, as a lingua franca, is most related to those concepts that with socialist internatioalism. That's not the case with Esperanto.

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[+] zloubida@lemmy.world 1 point 2 years ago

[deleted]

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[–] zloubida@lemmy.world 1 point 2 years ago

Considering that you're 20 years old, if you speak to a new Esperantist every hour, night and day, thus to 24 new Esperantist every day, you'll be 248 years old when you'll have spoken to every Esperantist.

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