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they don't mind (lemmy.blahaj.zone)
submitted 1 week ago by [email protected] to c/[email protected]
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[-] [email protected] 2 points 6 days ago* (last edited 6 days ago)

My hot take: there’s no such thing as “singular they” because you don’t need a special case for using plural pronouns with a single person; the basic usage already allows that. The plural pronouns refer to a group of people of any size. That includes a group of size 1.

A group of only one person is still a group of people.

That’s why it has always been correct to refer to a single person using the plural pronouns; you’re not directly referring to the person but rather to the group consisting of just that one person.

The reason this confuses people isn’t because the usage is incorrect but rather because what they were taught is incorrect.

People are taught that plural pronouns only refer to more than one person and that has always been wrong.

To see why that’s wrong, consider what happens when the size of the group is neither exactly one or more than one. For example if the group is actually empty or if you don’t know how many people are in it.

In both those cases you need to use the plural pronoun.

If the plural pronouns are a valid choice for both a group of size zero and a group of size two, then it would be ridiculous to argue that they are not a valid choice for a group of size one.

[-] [email protected] 5 points 6 days ago

Hot take? That's simply not true.

From the Chicago Manual of Style:

5.51: Generic singular “they” Traditionally, a singular antecedent requires a singular pronoun. But even beforetheir, and themselves (or possibly themself) as generic singular forms—especially in speech and informal prose.

So, "They" is commonly used to refer to a singular person of unknown gender or sex. You'll see it in the news occasionally.

"An intruder wearing a chicken mascot costume was caught on video breaking into a bank. They stuffed their costume full of $100 bills before fleeing the scene."

Sure, writers will more likely not use pronouns at all, maybe saying "the assailant," but when a pronoun is used, "they" and "their" would be perfectly fine.

[-] [email protected] 3 points 6 days ago

I think you misunderstood what I’m saying.

I’m not saying you can’t use “they” when referring to a single person; I’m saying that when you do that you haven’t deviated from the simple usage in any way shape or form.

I’m saying there’s no “singular they” because using “they” in that context is just the same as any other usage of “they”. It isn’t any sort of exception to the base rules and so doesn’t require any special treatment.

[-] [email protected] 2 points 6 days ago

you did though, it was your first line:

My hot take: there’s no such thing as “singular they”

[-] [email protected] 2 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago)

They are saying plural means 1 or many while singular means only 1. So 'they' was always plural and plural always included singular.

Sadly dictionary definition says plural does not include 1.

[-] [email protected] 3 points 6 days ago

pedantic language nerds on Lemmy? no way!

[-] [email protected] 1 points 6 days ago

nm, the rest of the thread is the same.. you are not alone.

[-] [email protected] 2 points 6 days ago* (last edited 6 days ago)

It’s obvious what I meant from that is the opposite of how you are construing it. You need to actually read the entire comment.

[-] [email protected] 2 points 6 days ago

it's not obvious, sorry. if it were, people would be agreeing with you

[-] [email protected] 0 points 6 days ago

Oh, I get what you're saying.

However, I'm kindly informing you that posting who are professionally pedantic don't agree with this.

Perhaps I've missed a style guide that does agree with you, in which case I would be happy for you to bring the receipts.

[-] [email protected] -1 points 6 days ago

when the group size is 1, it's singular

[-] [email protected] 2 points 6 days ago

OK, I’ll bite; do we need a concept for a “dual they” or a “ternary they”.

If so, then fine “singular they” deserves to be called out too. If not, then treating “singular they” as a special case just gives bigots space to claim that it’s some sort of deviation from the norm which then gives them cover for falsely claiming that usage is incorrect.

[-] [email protected] 1 points 6 days ago

we don't need a new pronoun, the existing singular "they" is fine. bigots don't understand it, and think that it's grammatically incorrect. they are wrong. we don't need to cater to their ignorance.

[-] [email protected] 1 points 6 days ago* (last edited 6 days ago)

I think sanskrit has singular, dual, and 'three and above' nouns and pronouns

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[-] [email protected] 90 points 1 week ago

Every single person who complains that “they” is weird has, without the slightest wisp of a shadow of a doubt, said something along the lines of “yeah their coat is just over there” or “I think they were saying that…”. They can already do it, and it’s not hard, they just really wanna hate.

[-] [email protected] 30 points 1 week ago

I'm fine with 'they', but I think you're misrepresenting the very real problem that is inserting a 3rd-person pronoun as a personal pronoun due to the existing patterns ingrained and interpreted through speech.

It doesn't hurt me to try and make the conscious change, I do actively try for the people in my life, but it DOES flow weird in my brain and takes more mental effort to keep straight. At least, it still does, it might get easier with more time, I don't know.

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[-] [email protected] 37 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago)

The singular "they" isn't even the first time English has specifically appropriated a plural pronoun for the singular for the sake of social respect!!!

We don't even use the second person singular "thou" anymore, we just use "you" for both of them!

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[-] [email protected] 29 points 1 week ago
[-] [email protected] 30 points 1 week ago
[-] [email protected] 21 points 1 week ago

It's an inherited property, so yeah them too

[-] [email protected] 24 points 1 week ago

"They did a great job on the last project. They are a valuable member of the team"

[-] [email protected] 23 points 1 week ago

Only weirdos talk to tits, I, as a gentleman, always address each individually (by their preferred pronouns ofc).

/s

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[-] [email protected] 21 points 1 week ago

I have (begrudgingly) gotten used to "singular they". I accept that I am not an authority on how language is used, and this is how the language has evolved. I'd have preferred a separate singular non-gendered pronoun, but I wasn't consulted because, again, not an authority on the subject. It is fine, I will adapt (and have already done so to some degree).

HOWEVER, I still have beef with what happened to "literally" and will bring it up any time semantic shift is the subject of conversation.

[-] [email protected] 35 points 1 week ago

Asking "how are they doing" when referring to a singular third person has literally always been normal english. The singular they has basically always been fine and proper english.

[-] [email protected] 27 points 1 week ago

Shakespeare had no problem with singular they, by the way.

I also found it natural to use before I had a concept of those existing outside the gender binary. "Who left their umbrella?"

Mentioning semantic shift here doesn't seem to do anything but make me imagine you are grandpa Simpson yelling at passing clouds.

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this post was submitted on 11 Jul 2025
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